That's my main problem with the Uprising fluff. A wizard did it and all Japanese citizens of YJ were indoctrinated to blindly follow the emperor. All but small ninja clans who see merits to side with YJ. Really? Even the not so socially integrated and rebellious bike gangers? No provincial dojo's didn't see the opportunity to stay and rise in power as well? What about small companies who were not so important to be integrated in ten no bushi program? What about mixed families? And so on... Few generations of Japanese people living inside of the YJ and all of them still blindly follow the emperor because of the indoctrination. We get the info about Kempeitai eliminating Japanese officers who were loyal to the party but it would be nice to hear some regiments just took action against the commanding kempeitai and stayed loyal. During the Sengoku period those loyal and honourable samurai generals could change sides during the battle and now everyone blindly obeys. I'd love to see something like this mentioned in the fluff. Also it's funny how now every member of JSA society follows bushido code. Really? Japan got back to a Edo social class order yet everyone follows the code of samurai? Also I get the feeling from the fluff that the uprising conflict is just evil China versus not so good, manipulated Japan but wasn't YJ suppsed to be Panasian empire? So what about other Asian nations that are kind of never mentioned in the stories?
I mean, I agree with you in general, but, it is what it is at this point. Which is why I'm going for the 'bring it forward' approach :) Perhaps tone is difficult to get across here, or perhaps it's because of the nature of this issue (I knew I'd piss off a few people at least lol), but I'd appreciate you not attack ME in the process of being upset with the circumstances. I'm sorry if you don't like my solution...but, that's what I've chosen to go with :) I don't think there's anything WRONG with re-writing the fluff per se. But my thought is CB is MUCH more likely to pick up on something I write if it incorporates pre-published material. Since, you know, they really CAN'T go back and undo it at this point. Short of a total retcon, I mean.
Personally I actually like the way the ninja were handled, so I wouldn't really do anything with that. But maybe I'm just confused: what is it precisely that you feel is weird about some ninja remaining behind in Yu Jing? I totally agree about the heroes angle. Not sure I like the idea of wuxia characters per se (never been a big fan of martial arts movies), but again that's just me. Although...here's a thought. And I'll need someone who knows more Chinese history than me to answer this: what if there was a new 'recreation' sent to be Sun Tze's sort of 'evil' mirror to keep the ISS in line? Like, one who was ultimately more ruthless and had more of the respect of the ISS, and could reign them in, but was ultimately loyal to ALEPH and O-12? Just thinking off the top of my head... How would you indicate the 'backstabbing' angle? Just some sort of news reports about shady activities? Or are you saying you want similarly 'large scale' events to happen to the other factions?
Its weird since ONLY Ninjas stayed. No Japanese civilians. No Japanese regular troops. Not even the Ninja leaders (Oniwaban are the leaders of each Ninja group).
It's a half-measure. "We move the story forward! Big changes! But we won't touch the one thing that people actually used, that we crystallise and leave as it is". What it tells me, someone who actually followed a bit of GW's reasoning, is that they've adopted the... flexible timeline... that some games have. It's not just Games Workshop doing it, far from it, you get that stuff even in publications that try to be historically accurate like War Thunder (because otherwise the Germans would win far too often and the Japanese would win everything in early era and lose everything in late era). The smaller clans that opted for loyalty over tradition are bound to do things a different way, and, at least to me, it is more logical that they should not be carbon copies of JSA Ninjas. Plus, it would be very nice to have a clean break and it would be something new the Yu Jingse players "get out of it" that is very low cost in terms of development. No, it really doesn't have to be grand scale like Uprising. But let's say we hypothetically start the next campaign unexpectedly with a high-profile murder of a Pan-Oceanian diplomat and executive (because let's face it, a Pan-O diplomat would sit on many boards of directors). Something's afoot, Haqq are blaming lax security and alien infiltration, Hexahedron points to the Man in the Mountain, but with this diplomat gone a planned business offensive on Nomad interests is stopped dead in its tracks for a short period of time - who murdered the diplomat? More importantly, this Nomad owned shipyard, ones destined for a sure hostile take over, has now blown wide open for other ventures to move in, provided you can get rid of the opposition. That's spreading it wide, I know, but you get the point. The initial plot line doesn't - shouldn't - revolve around Uprising. Do a Steven Eriksson, leave a loose thread hanging, you can pick it up later. Not every plot line has to be chased to completion before starting the next. So basically what I'm saying is; I think at this point the next major event should probably not have to do with Yu Jing at all.
I'd rather not see another recreation added to the roster. I feel that that would come across as a cheap and lazy way to add characters to Yu Jing's line up. I agree that we should look more broadly for character ideas rather than throwing in something wuxia related. China actually has a breadth of pop culture influences that we could use. The Hong Kong film industry also has some very iconic Police drama films and the whole cat and mouse/undercover cop - triad gangster storyline is one that has been used many times over. This would make for a great character for the ISS, though I would prefer to see other aspects of Yu Jing explored instead of one overplayed sectorial. For me, rather than basing a character on any existing aspect of Chinese pop culture, I'd like to see a run of the mill citizen of the State Empire displaying heroic loyalty to Yu Jing as a matter of principle. Maybe the State Army took them out of a life of poverty, or maybe they just truly believe in Yu Jing's mission statement, whatever that is. Maybe they really are a true believer and Yu Jing in their eyes is the greatest benefactor of the poor and downtrodden, (unlike those exploitative PanO hypocrites!). It would help humanize the faction from an angle that they are currently a bit lacking in. Don't base the character on ancient Chinese History or present day Chinese Pop Culture . Base the character on Yu Jing.
Oh, 100%. I'll buy the entire Yu Jing range the day that comes out :) Was my favorite disney movie as a kid.
I would really like that too. But only if Yu Jing actually listened to her and valued her like all the other factions value their Recreations. [Not the way they [CB] treat Sun Tze as a completely ineffective character]
I'm in the Mulan camp for sure, and also the Guan Yu camp, and also the Norman-Bethune-for-Invincible-Army-Akbar-Doctor camp, the depth of Chinese history provides so very much to work with. But if you want to provide an alternate, a 'dark Sun Tse'... Sun as presented in Infinity isn't perfect as a historical representation, nor as an avatar of the Art of War. For certain he has a bit of the Confucian about him and his portrayal, to me the Recreation that counters him comes down to the classical debate between Confucianism and Legalism. I'm not sure how much Gutier was referencing that in Uprising, but it is definitively how things were depicted, with Yu Jing abandoning both Sun Tse's advice and all Confucian precepts, embracing Legalism wholesale. In actual history the results were clear, the complete failure of a dynasty operated by legalist principle and the wholesale adoption of Confucianism to replace the flawed and discredited system. You can shape a counter-Sun as an alternative to be harsh in reforming after Uprising, or you can shape a counter-Sun as an alternative voice whose brutal advice results in everything we've seen in Uprising, either way I think there's one option: Qin Shi Huang.
I have a feeling that won't fly. The Party was very careful to check the power of their sitting emperors. I doubt they will approve of a recreation of the First Emperor of a unified China. Heroes like Mulan and Guan Yu are safer because they can inspire without usurping the government's authority. It is quite a bit different when your legend is wrapped up in being the authority. On topic, I would like a dynasty change. Whether the Emperor steps down or has an accident, enough has happened under their watch. That said, I would enjoy more non Chinese characters and not just expats such as Lunah. Let Yu Jing embrace the pan Asian identity.
Amen. Now let us all bow and pray, brothers and sisters, for the glories we look to with anticipation and much grinning.
@banthafodder I totally agree. Give us a korean or vietnamese unit or anything. PanO has Akalis and Bagh Mari and we have..eeeh. Gesendet von meinem SM-J500FN mit Tapatalk
Mulan doesn't need a recreation. This game has quite a few homage characters that are not recreations, sometimes literally named after what they mimic. Besides, Disney is sue-happy if you get too close to their IP. Mulan could simply be an exceptional Shang-Ji commander. Hell, she might not even have to be Mulan, just have received it as a nickname due to accomplishments. Wrong faction. :-P
Amen Agreed.. Now let us all bow and pray raise our fists, brothers and sisters citizen-subjects, for the glories we look to with anticipation and much grinning. -Copy returned for correction. StateEmpire Ministry of Information, Forum Post Monitoring Department.-
Resolution to the fluff... The best explanation for the poor characterization of Yu Jing during this event is that CA infiltrators were in among everybody and were stoking the flames to try to destabilize the Sphere. Unfortunately, that would require a certain level of self-awareness of the poor quality of the fluff from the people responsible, which would be... unlikely.
Not that changing it from "a wizard did it" to "a speculo did it" would suppose a massive jump in quality anyway.
Kuang Shi all get MA and improved CC, as their ranks are now comprised entirely of Japanese traitors.
