StarCo thoughts after first battles

My fear of KHDs comes from running the Interventor KHD myself, who is brutal to Hackers and Assault Hackers. Something tells me that we will be seeing a lot more of her come June. In general though, your point is taken. There was a lot of hype regarding KHD when they came out, but in reality they are just another threat.

 

Totally. I just never got the "they're gonna have KHDs, I'm not going to run a hacker" mentality. It's like saying "they're gonna have msv2, I won't bring smoke or TO camo".

 

If they send a KHD to get your Brigada you're at least forcing them to use orders attacking something other than your TAG.

 

This evening I found out that HVT: Kidnapping is not the best objective to get in highly classified since only Mobile Brigadas, Hellcats and Emily are able to fulfill that objective.

 

So, if Uhahu gets Redrum'd, do you go for Breakwater and the -6 to your opponent, or Suckerpunch with the -3 and chance to kill.

I'd lean toward Breakwater to make things even against a surprise attack, though such a large shift does a lot to up Uhahu's survivability.

 

@Jassal2.0 A lot of times you can't declare Breakwater because at the time you declare an ARO you aren't targeted by a hacking attack yet.

My thought on it, when you have the choice, is how many orders my opponent has left. If they only have 1 or 2, I'll throw Breakwater, because I have a higher chance to survive. If they have three or more, I'll throw Sucker Punch, because at that point my best chance is getting lucky and hitting them with the Sucker Punch.

 

Depends on what you want, really.
If you want to waste as many Orders as possible or need maximum short term survival odds (1-2 Orders) Breakwater.
Non lethal Hacking has also served me well to prevent the other guy from entering Retreat before you want him to - I've used it in Active Turn more often than in Reactive.

For everything else Suckerpunch. If you suspect your oppoent will keep spending Orders till Uhahu is dead and a HD+ is crucial for your gameplan you're better off trying to end the threat permanently.
Same goes for when you are playing from behind and need a couple hail mary's to get you back in the game.
Funny enough this also applies if you are ahead and don't really care if you lose Uhahu or not - you can simply gamble to win even harder.

 

@Hecaton If it's a surprise attack, you can always get Breakwater off, due to timing and stealth not generating an ARO from movement. That -6 is great against average and low WIP targets.

If there isn't stealth in play, then yes, you're pretty much forced to use Sucker.

I like the extra wound on Uhahu, but it seems like a moot point against high damage, double trouble attacks.


Actually, just ran the numbers for science. This is all Breakwater. First go is a non-surprise attack:
Zeros vs. Custom Unit
Active Player
34.37% Zeros inflicts 1 or more wounds on Custom Unit (0 W)
20.62% Zeros inflicts 2 or more wounds on Custom Unit (Dead)

It gets much worse if it's a surprise attack:
Active Player
40.84% Zeros inflicts 1 or more wounds on Custom Unit (0 W)
24.41% Zeros inflicts 2 or more wounds on Custom Unit (Dead)

And then surpise, Redrum, and thru a repeater is more or less the same. At the point, it seems like the limiting factor is the Zero failing.

This is Redrum vs Sucker Punch:
Active Player
49.05% Zeros inflicts 1 or more wounds on Custom Unit (0 W)
30.82% Zeros inflicts 2 or more wounds on Custom Unit (Dead)

Failures
20.22% Neither player succeeds
Reactive Player
30.73% Custom Unit inflicts 1 or more wounds on Zeros (Unconscious)
21.09% Custom Unit inflicts 2 or more wounds on Zeros (Dead


So, clearly enough, Breakwater is way better in preserving Uhahu. I think with some average rolls that she could tank 4-5 orders, which is awesome

 

Stealth is optional. You can delay your ARO against Tokens however.

 

Spector is a killing machine, absolutely. Did you use him as an AD troop or a MULTI Rifle?

 

Do the numbers versus Kerr Nau or Scylla :P (this is why I think Maestro is BS)

Also, why is the Zero Redrum'ing Uhahu: it's literally the ONLY time that Trinity is a better call than Redrum.

The other point to note with Breakwater vs KHD is 'how many orders do they have to waste': if the answer is 'not enough' then Breakwater vs Surprise Shot <Programme>, Suckerpunch vs <Programme> is probably the best way to do it. If however, they've got more than enough orders that wasting them doesn't really get you anywhere then Suckerpunch is the better call as it's the only way to actually stop the pain. In the example you cited there's a 1/3 chance of rendering the KHD UNC which is worth trying for.

KHDs are a managable threat: the reason why they're stupid is because they're needlessly complex and they get effective DAM19 when fighting through Repeaters. If they were (something like) DAM14 (ie the same as Brainblast) with B2 +3 WIP Shock/Breaker and B1 - 3 OPP WIP DT they'd be 1000% more reasonable. Then you'd make Maesto just a Mono equivalent: B2 +3 WIP, DAM11 Ignores BTS, causes UNC.

 

Yea but you cannot maestro uhahu into unconsciousness. It's really annoying as an aleph player.

 

My thoughts recently;

-One of our best shooters is still going to be the Tsyklon with MML2. Fast, tough, serious range and firepower, hitting on 12s up to 32" with the X-Visor is a big advantage on top of being able to murder things within 24" very effectively. Uhahu and the Tsyklon will be a regular in all my lists, just so flexible and capable.

-A lot of our forces are effective and skilled, but light troops. Outside of the MB, Anaconda and Riots, there's a lot of light infantry, skirmishers, warbands and such, and without TO Camo, ODD or anything seriously penalty inducing like that, our stuff is not going to throw down with linked Sukuels and such that effectively. Solution? Broad approach, lots of light gear, plenty of orders. When not taking HI links, I am going to try to be hovering around 14-15 orders, maybe even 16, but with a few irregulars as we do have some great irregular options like the hardcase and bandit.

 

Engineers, especially fast ones, especially if they could smoke the target to repair them safely, drastically increase the strength of the Nomad REM because of their unconcious states and higher ARM. 3 ARM doesn't save the first wound that much more often, but between 3 wounds it has a lot more chances to save.

 

I mean it's also just pretty tough for regular hits. ARM 6 in cover is no joke, and I've lost count of how many times my opponents have complained my Tsyklon in cover with MML2 on Suppression Fire is invincible. And yes I was thinking that the Irmandino would be able to keep up with the Anaconda and provide close protection, but given that actually you don't get re-rolls, and it has the escape system, I don't see myself really repairing it that much? Comparatively the impetuous order and smoke means that he can get up to our MOV 6-4 killbot and fix it if it goes down very effectively, as well as providing a nearby smoke cover and chain rifle in case anyone tries to sneak up on it.

Uhahu plus Irmandino plus Tsyklon equals happy Solar.

 

@Solar engineer on Anaconda is for Isolation/IMM2.

 

Which is a thing, for sure

Less of a thing than being shot generally, but worth having that Engineer around anyway.

 

Depends on your opponent.

I don't usually have an Engineer even with a TAG unless I'm playing Wildcats or if it comes on my WB anyways.

 

Yeah but usually that's the Iguana right?

And it's the same deal, you aren't going to be Engineering the Iggy if it gets damaged.

Usually it's the Geckos for me, and they definitely do benefit from a Clockmaker or Tomcat.