Conclusion: andromeda will see table only if Tarik and Kusanagi become gods, else Andromeda will keep looking from the bookcase.
That is disappointing. From what little I know about the characters that have been sidelined it seems most of them could use a little tweak. Oh well C'est la vie. Andromeda cavalry on a battle cat would be terribly cheesy and would clash horribly with the rest of the range. That being said, now my inner 12 year old, really wants a mounted Andromeda with plasma spear.
One advantage Guard has over G:Synch/Servant is the ability to be used in Coordinated orders. That is not a small thing.
Yeah I saw that. That seems like...the worst way they could have possibly handled it lol. Removal of the units...just for the sake of what, making sure fans are good and butthurt for the next Uprising-style rage event? ;) lol
We won't miss units we don't use ... The best thing would be to rework Guard, S4 is really a drawback and Guard don't really bring anything unique, it's just a tuned-down martial arts.
Its not that Guard is bad. A guard model will kill any non-cc dedicated troopers in cc. The point is, that guard is superfluous as there already is a cc skill, and a mechanic for linking two models. So both a game mechanic to do, what it does, and a Mechanic to replicate the fluff. So its just a rules bloat.
I would still say it is bad, because the fact that it is better cc-wise comes with being S4, and i find that S4 has a far greater negative effect than being better in cc. CC is not a common occurrence, it is somewhat unreliable and can be tricky to exploit, whereas being S4 will be a common problem starting from the deployment (less spots to hide a S4, more difficult to move with such a base ...). The worst is, we are one of the best CC army of the game, we have so many better alternatives to Andromeda.
Primary problem with andromeda: bloat. She pays for a LOT of special rules, but most of them are quite niche or barely inferior to existing ones. In an army of elite specialists she does a bit of everything at a pricy premium. So, imo: cut some rules, especially expensive ones. Maybe turn her into a FO, since that's cheap. But then again, haven't read her fluff.
I agree for bloat, like having flash pulse, SMG, breaker pistol and DA CCW on the cheapest profile - the breaker pistol is not that useful since she has both a short range B3 AP weapon and a good CCW. FO wouldnt be a great benefit through, since she's already a specialist with a flashpulse, it would just allows her to mark targets. Her worst point is that Thrasimedes is already better at what she can do, for a similar (even lower) price. She is NWI, but he has ODD, S2 and infiltration. And in vanilla, nagas are in the same price range, but are far more useful. She is just a sort of all rounded infiltrator for SP.
I actually like Adromeda, and my only problem with her is her S4. Thanx to NWI and CC prowess she's a better counter to warbands than Thrasymedes; his ODD does squat against Chain Rifles and other DTWs. She's also more reliable - no Frenzy, no loss of cover later on. And anyway, many people prefer to use Thrasymedes as Thorakitai leader rather than infiltrator. The model is fairly static, too. She could ride Cetus for that MOV 6-4 (even 6-2 would do) ;)
id rather use penny for that duty. Better mov, threatens tags/hi with that mono ccw, better ARO gun, and impetuous is rather easy to exploit yourself, usually ending up being a free order per turn. Ikhol 2+odd means that aro's when she gets into CC are completely shagged at -12. Basically, for the same price a naga/dasyu, in SP rather penny. If she was cheaper then a naga id debate taking her.
Penny is a serious competition, but has a few drawbacks, too. She's pricy at 41 pts; Impetous, so no cover from the beginning; I-kohl doesn't work against TAGs, so engaging them in CC can be a gamble.
There really is nothing in the Guard rule, that mandates models to be S4. It just happen to be the S of V and A. But again, Andromeda would have been a lot more interesting to play with MA2 and a G:Sync model to give her B2 or the TecTiger could have a High PH and special ammo claws, so you’d need to choose between a high CC stat or high damage potential - and giving an opponent the chance for an unopposed attack.
I'll have to disagree that it is superfluous. By being a single model they intentionally restrict the ability to easily get 2 units into CC, but we gain the ability to be used in Coordinated Orders. I don't know about you, but there are lots of times I get annoyed by not being able to CO someone due to Synch or Servant. It provides different options than say an Uberfall team or Drakios. They could have given her Synch and MA, but then she wouldn't be as unique. I see the problem as either Guard being overcosted or not providing a full thematic set of skills with it.
If they'd wanted Guard to be a nice, fluffy addition to the game rather than just another CC skill table, they should have given it a constant +1 Burst, with other mods varying by level. Would that have required rebalancing the CC values of its users? Sure, but it would have been worth it and none of us would have ever known the difference since those profiles were new to the game anyway. Guard's supposed to represent the presence of an extra combatant, not its user suddenly growing a Hulk ragefist as the current damage emphasis suggests. I've griped about this before, so I'll just shut up and see myself out now. :-)
Similar, not the same. There are the different bonuses, different stacked skills (Stealth and Surprise Attack in MA, only Courage in Guard). The difference in profiles for Voronin and Andromeda shows how they can modify the unit around the Guard skill to reach their intended use/fluff. SSL2 on Voronin vs Stealth on Andromeda for example. I'll note that you keep ignoring my post's point that Guard provides an interesting alternative to Synch. I'm not sure why you decided that meant that anything else than what I stated there. I never expressed and opinion that the skill was good or bad, but that in comparison to alternative skills people were proposing it had variations.
Exactly, similar, not the same - but its a question of, just how much detail a miniature game needs. Take the case of 40K, that started with a shared list of armour, equipment and weapons, and ended with Bloody Wolfblood Bloodmissiles of Bloody handed Wolfblood Doom +2. There is an art in keeping the rules free of bloat. So yeah, I ignore your interested view on the matter, simply because I do not agree - heck, you wouldn’t need to give either of the models MA, that was just an example. A high CC stat in itself and a decent CC weapon is enough - especially with the potential of B2+.
It's not just S4, it might work with a token state or a Marksman rifle. But the mix of limited range, large size, and no token state or smoke, makes her one of the least mobile models I know. They combine so poorly. Any one of those changed would help her a lot. Her actual combat stats are great. I mean Bandits are probably tied for my strongest unit and she has a lot of that. Exactly the unit archtype I look for. But they shot her in the foot with a bazooka.
It also helps little to be the closest model to the enemy with the lowest level of camo (tied with Achilles V2), so she is so much a target of opportunity... in a sectorial with limited ARO capabilities that do not involve smoke (which she has not...). In fact, making her a kinda Guarda de Assalto (with a bot launching Eclipse Grenades) would be great, but... O making the dog a Tohaa one, a HI syncronized troop with melee... Heck, even a damn Zoe+Pi Well option where they are not a single unit!
