CA definitely had enough power pieces before this. Although how all the profiles translate over remains to be seen. From a story telling lore perspective, this move makes complete sense to me. The CA is the big bad boogie man. Achilles is one of the greatest hero’s in the human sphere, quite literally designed and built to fight them. If I was the CA, and I wanted to break the morale of humanity and their trust in their precious AI saviors, I would do just that, take there greatest hero and turn him against them. Killing hero’s makes them a martyr. But turning them makes everyone question everything they know and believe. It’s a massive psychological warfare tactic. Is it good for business? There are a lot of sides to that coin. The uprising has been referenced a lot. And while there was a lot of shock and pain involved in that change, I’d say CB gambled and it payed off in the end. JSA has been a top selling army in spite of it’s difficulty to become proficient in because people have loved the concept and overall design, so much so that it’s made them decide to poor more recourses into it now. Will these coming changes end on a sweet or sour note? Probably will depend on a lot of factors for each of us. But Aleph has yet to see if they will be given something in exchange for this change. I personally feel like there’s a lot more to be seen before I could make any kind of judgement on how I feel. But it’s definitely interesting to see them take such big risks for the sake of the evolution of the game universe. (Regardless of their internal motivations, that’s how it translates to me anyway.)
I’d look past Achilles and the lads now and start building a case for what Greek heroes you want included. For Example Jason and the Argonauts get raised - Set off on a quest to find the cure for Sepsiterisation and bring Achilles and the team back into the Fold. Hector and Penesthilea get to work reining Achilles in. Replace Homeridae with Argonauts
I'd rather actual historical people rather than fictional character. There's no proof that anyone in Homer's story was real. Actually that's al of SP. None of them are based on people we know existed. They could just make a John Wick and just win the game.
I think to remember that in the video Bostria announced Eudoros new mini he briefly mentioned that he constantly compete to be better than Achilles and this is why he changed his body and has strength instead of wound. So maybe can be that we will have an update of the Eudoros profile or a v2.0. But I need to remember that this is CB so most probably there are no long plans or connections and SP will not get anything or in the better case just a useless profile to calm down the SP player
Sorry. Can’t let this slide. We absolutely have evidence that some of the mythical heroes actually existed. Whilst the mythology itself cannot be proven (and indeed via all Known scientific knowledge of how the world works would seemingly be disproven) the basis for the mythology has historical evidence. For example we know from the extensive archaeological digs at the site of Troy that the city was besieged by Greek forces from what appears to be Mycenae and Pylos in the time frame that Homer described. We also have various writings from outside sources that support that there was such an attack. The king of the period, one Aleksandus has been heavily associated with Paris and though this ruler of the city appears roughly half a century before Homers Iliad is set, many archaeologists would argue and indeed have that when arguing time frames for history, particularly one as contentious as the Bronze Age, fifty years is a drop in the bucket. For a very, very, very brief look; https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alaksandu Sorry again. I studied this period heavily when I was doing my first degree. As I said, whilst the mythology is unlikely, there is historical evidence for Troy and its events. You could make the case for more esoteric mythological elements being left out in favour of more historical ones but at this point we have Pandora active and there’s definitively only allegorical evidence for her actual existence rather than any material evidence.
On the other hand for you everything CB does is perfect and mana from the gods themselves. This is Rings of Power writing level with Galadriel getting a Ring because it drops next to her feet, it is THAT bad and a cheap "you won't believe what happened next" empty hype bait.
How many players stopped playing Infinity because of Ko-Dali? That number is probably close to zero. Also, do you really think the Uprising made CB lose players or money? After a few years, I think we can all admit that it's far from being the case. Just look how well JSA sells (and will continue to sell as a new faction with a million new units)... I'd say the balance is excellent for CB. Well, again, considering how CB is doing, I'd say it's rather good marketing. How many people will hate Achilles moving to CA? How many people will love that and buy the minis, or even start playing CA just because of that? Again, I'd say the balance is far in favour of CB on this, which is the reason they are doing it. The dudes at CB have no interest in sabotaging their business, they are thinking about the consequences. And it seems that, based on the informations they have (which are of course much more accurate than the little we know), that the consequences are beneficial to them.
Saw it coming. Helens argument with Aleph, Pandora persuading Achilles to fight instead of lament Patroclus. Pandora herself… Aleph is a machine and his creations are more machine than man. Two dimensional Flesh bots. Perhaps he will infect the EI with them, perhaps we see Aristeia with morat. In any circumstance the real man Max will protect Earth, I’m building PanO.
We still don't know if Aleph/SP will loose these 4 units, but considering curent fluff it would be very hard to make it belivable if we share them with CA. Losig Drakios and Teucer is small, both of these were outclassed and not used often. With Achilles it's a little different. He was powerfull but balanced and fair. Played more in Vanilla than SP but still quite popular and FUN to play. Also he is a symbol for SP and Aleph in general. The bighest problem is with Pandora. Not only is she good and actually played in lists, the biggest problem is that she is around 2 year old LIMITED model sold in preorder budle for 2 factions. Some people preordered having Pandora in mind, and now what? Sell it, she is enemy now after 2 years. Bullshit if thats what happens.
Losing a way to use models is indeed much more unpleasant than losing a unit from army roster. Though I'm sure there will be a sensible way to proxy them, even if some people dislike to proxy stuff. Regarding Aleph evolution, I could totally see it going another way, instead of trying to double down on heroes. Focusing on units, interchangeable, anonymous, soulless - because, as we've seen, the soul can get corrupted. So instead of individuals who can be both a strength but also a weakness, you would get a real phalanx, a wall of shields with machine-like determination and blank stares behind it. And it could work narratively, too, with humans becoming slightly unnerved at how Aleph changes and how it apparently came to regard making humanlike units a mistake. I doubt CB would go this way, but it could be fun to observe.
So wait, by your logic everything GW did from squatting the Squats to the Primaris hit to the last removals of Stormcast unit that were 4 years old, all of that is great? Because at the end of the day GW is getting more revenue that ever, so surely those were amazing decisions and GW is the greatest miniature games company, right? Or that only counts when you want to whiteknight for CB? By the way, my community (and me, believe it or not) was pretty hyped for N5 and this Achilles nonsense along with the 13 skills Japanese profiles kinda took the wind out of our sails, not exactly because one exact thing but because this has been going for a long times, and seeing no changes for the better gets old, specially with the amount of good skirmish games out there in the market. We fully expect N5 to be nothing more than N4 with some makeup on, launched just to generate hype and get cash (like the corvillion LE miniatures and thinly veiled Infinity Kickstarters)
I think Leonidas would be a fine addition (eyes at Thermopilae miniature released for Aristeia ;)). One thing is for sure: ALEPH is lacking in options. As of now there are 3 or 4 max copy/paste lists and not much else. Vedic needs a boost in that regard and obviously SP needs a boost (even though Dracios, Teucer, Diomedes and Thamiris were hardly considered and I believe only bought by collectors). If anything my worry is that ALEPH gets incorporated in O-12 and that would be something I would not like. I suppose, "obtorto collo", we gotta wait... however CB better make the wait worthwhile because already CA is becoming the Space Marines of Infinity and the idea of such a faction already destroyed one game too many.
I have no damn idea what GW is doing for like the past 10 years. You'll have to find another example if you want to make a point. You and you community are not a representative sample of the Infinity community. On the contrary, almost everyone around me is hyped. It seems it's not all bad for everyone.
It's hardly news that opinions are split. Some people like it, some don't, vocal minorities from both sides claim to be the vox populi, while most people don't care that much to get into arguments online and prefer to simply play the game. Even if some of the changes aren't to their liking.
I've said it before, I'll keep saying in to hammer the idea (maybe it sticks): CB would do good to publish a list of suggested substitutions for models represetning discontinued units / profiles. A proxy guide for legacy sculpts. Eg. what I've mentioned already in this topic - using Corinthian Achilles as proxy Hoplite, and basic Achilles & Patroclous as proxy Myrmidon Officers. ....hmm, paging @Koni ... ...and honestly, failing that, the community could set up a similar set of suggested proxies, once we know what models are going to no longer be with us. Of course, it wouldn't have the same weight as one done by CB, but still, a bit of help.
And if I were in PanOceania I'd have blown up Paradiso's moon or something and turned the Acheron wormhole into an innavigable debris field, thereby forcing the CA to bugger off for a few hundred years. But that's no fun, and neither is shuffling a bunch of beloved models over to a faction that is doing just fine. Seriously, even GW knows better than to pull this nonsense- of all the undead and corrupting armies across their ranges, not one of them features a character that once belonged to another faction in the (real-life) past. Not one turned-to-Chaos Marine character, no ressurected-and-evil Brettonians, no Elves deciding to be less edgy. That's telling, given GW has low standards for community interest and a truly massive range. JSA sells well, but it cost a lot of players who otherwise would be supplementing their Japanese armies with Yu Jing shooting in Vanilla or Yu Jing players looking for some CC bite. I know I would have bought an O-Yoroi for sure had I actually been able, and some Aragotos a few years after that with N4.
As soon as Patroclus died and Aleph created Pandora, the writing was on the wall that some shit was about to go down, fluff wise. I think a lot of people were expecting some kind of devastating final defeat, rather than a new cold war. Personally, I'm all-the-way-stoked for this plot development instead. Achilles' defection, due to Aleph's refusal to spin up Patroclus, is a really in-character development, and will no doubt cause Aleph to roll out a far mor classically-heroic leader. Who can say who it will be, but my money is on either Jason, Herakles or Odysseus. It's also, perversely enough, good news for Aleph. There's no doubt that they'll get a host of new units to make up for the desertion, and I'd say the odds are good that they're next up for a revamp of some kind, after sandtrap, because they've just grabbed the spotlight in Infinity's central plotline. Finally, playing evil Achilles will also be bloody fun and a tasty grudge match. Well played CB.
Of course not, you can't get hard numbers for sales that didn't happen. It's anecdotal, based on hearsay on the forums and the FLGS as well as my own experience that many Yu Jing players that wanted JSA units never bought them. It's nevertheless hearsay with a few thousand pages of writing about it; don't make me dig up the Uprising threads, they're long.
