N5 Speculation

I well remeber the late N2 era where 2 full (or almost full) Groups were essentially a must. It was very, very hard not to get out-Ordered and out-swarmed with a single Group army back in the day.
And with some armies, it was not uncommon to go above 2 full Groups.

15 models seems a reasonable compromise.
I've been playing a lot of single group, 250pts games in recent months (my opponent's go-to), and I highly appreciate how quick they are, comapred to Tactical Window 300pts games.

Of course, this means there's no space anymore for hordes of cheap Irregular models. But CB seems to be facilitating it into faction design, step by step (Haqq Sunduqbut and Hassassin Bokhtar being good examples). So, we might be seeing more of that apporach in N5.

 

Yeah, i see your point. But when im playing against a linked MVS in a core and i cant use smoke to advance, or use surprise to stack minuses and dont have acces to albedo ot Hackers+ and i can only risk to roll higher than him, i felt that i need that grenades

 

It's not that it's necessarily a bad thing, I've always found that 13-15 orders was a very satisfying and well rounded list. It's that I find this forced homogenization is boring. I don't have to wonder if I'll face the madman who took as many Daylami and baggage bots as possible in a mission ( that happened once, it was an experience) or the Highlander charge of smoke grenades and cheap bodies, or whatever other nonsense someone can dream up high model count or low.

 

I wish they had set the limit at 16 and not 15, for a simetry thing. I loved 8+8 lists. 7 in a group does not feel good enough and almost everytime i end with 10+5, with the 5 being only for ARO duties

 

I never really understood why it was 15 (other than just kinda working with 300pts... about 20pts. a model...), "one and a half" command groups just feels so weird and arbitrary...

 

First, any number below 20 would feel arbitrary.
I remember in N3, most lists with cheap irregulers (Ariadna, Haqq) filled 2 full combat groups and 17-18 was standard for others like VIRD. I think 15 was set to make them a bit short of orders to reduce the power of alpha strikes while helping 'elite' list by reducing slots for cheap expandables.

 

ARO or dedicated support.
We've been testing it in my meta at some point - a Doc (or Engineer) with a servant REM (or two) can work in a 3-model group. If the REMs are well-placed, and the Doc themselves is near your ARO model / defensive Fireteam, 3 Orders are usually enough to get in and heal a model.

I'd also risk a Hacker in such a secondary group, assuming you have a decent Repeater network.

 

If your army/sectorial do not have access to Albedo or Eclipse or White Noise, you should plan accordingly

- Coordinate Order against the Linked MSV in a core with 4 troopers that have a significative damage output. Panzerfaust are a classic, but even Multi Rifles or Contenders are good for this. Seriously.
- Combat Jump / Parachute to kill the link members to deactivate the core castle.
- Marker State into position to kill the link members to deactivate the core castle.
- Brute Force the FtF with a Highly Survivably Unit, such as a TAG.
- Use 'a rolling for 9s/10s/11s Speculative Fire' against the core castle.
- Targeted State into Guided Attack.

 

Now eliminate of the ecuation, no Ad troopers, no tag, no guided, and remember FT members are inmune to surprise, so advancing with marker state to roll the same or less than the fireteam member is a waste of orders.

And risking a tag against a MSV linked troop, equipped probably with anti TAG weapons like Multi sniper or missile launcher... Wow. Such a great advise

 

Why no AD troop?

Also, Marker State surely loses the Surprise Attack modifier aganst a 4+ Fireteam, but maintains its choice of range and angle of attack. So you can absolutely choose which model in the Fireteam you engage (with some luck, just one of them!), and depending on the exact choice of troops, you might have range advantage or Burst advantage (B 3 of a Combi / SMG / Marksman for example, vs generally B2 of a Fireteam member). Trying a gambit with a DTW - like a Shotgun blast - is also viable, especially if you can catch more than one Fireteam members under the template.
If your model came equipped with Mines, even better - lay a mine from out of LoS, and then engage with shooting, forcing the opponent to fork their ARO options: try dodging the mine (always at -3) and possibly your fire (FtF!) or take it and try shooting back...

If you have a hacker (either infiltrating, or with a Repeater that can turn up somewhere near the Fireteam), Spotlighting your target can help to even the odds.

If they are packed tightly, a Terminal Template weapon is good, too. If it can cover more than one enemy model, it is worth counting your odds.

Fireteams - especially big ones - are nasty in ARO, but:

• they are brittle. Drop one teammember, and the biggest part of the to-hit bonus goes away. Drop another (assuming there were 5 to start with), and 6th Sense goes the way of the Dodo (unless it was innate to the models).
• if the Fireteam was a "Pure" Fireteam with MSV L2, it had to be expensive. Meaning it took points to build that your opponent then lacked elsewhere. The quilt is, metaphorically, short somewhere: exploit that weakness.
• if it was a "Mixed" Fireteam, not all the members are just as tough (and probably not all of them have MSV L2). Pick off the weaker of the flock first, to cut on bounses the Team enjoys.

Also, TAGs (if you have one on-table) - if you can get a TAG with a B4 weapon within good range and in Cover, and you don't have ot engage multiple dangerous weapons at once, I'd absolutely try it. Sure, if the Team manages to land a hit with that AP+EX or T2 weapon, that's gonna hurt. But you are going to have Burst advantage, good range and proabalby a decent BS to start with. My money is on the TAG.
Of course, if you'll have to face multiple dangerous AROs at once, then it becomes too risky.

So, don't despair: there are ways.

 

because i dont have AD troops in CHA, or JSA, not other specific reason hahaha.
Also, no mines in CHA for some reason. Probably the only SK in the game without any kind of deployable

And as T2 user, yes is very frightening, but is not reliable wounding heavy troops, since it doesnt penetrate armor

 

Damn. A flat 15 model cap across the board is probably one of the more stifling design choices made in N4.
I maybe hold a candle that they might revisit it with nuance but it's a faint candle.

 

Is there any news on when Corvus Belli might drop some more information on the new edition, its basically out in 2 months and I see no planned events, hoping that maybe for this Global Week we might see some stuff.
I know CB is a small company and its difficult but you do see how some companies like GW create hype trains by releasing small tidbits for people to discuss and just create conversations, I was hoping to perhaps see something like this soon.

 

As a Hassassin player I agree powerful ARO pieces you have to resolve most of the time with some lateral thinking or with a lucky Fiday most of the time.

 

Uxia, maybe, but SAS are dedicated to acomplish missions, and not in all mission i can spam SAS

And then there is bad luck. Last tournament, i deployed Uxia in front of a Volkolak ML. 30 assault pistol dices later, Volkolak was in NWI and Uxia dead.

BTW, a lot of tools? We dont have any fire damage, mediocre hackers, almost zero deployables, our guided is crap. We only have tons of smoke and some good CC units. They are nice, indeed, that's why i keep playing them, but pretty straight forward

 

Same argument could be made about just any unit and any loadout, in a game of max 15 models.
Every model you choose needs to be there for a reason anyway.

And what does it prove?
That Lady Fortune is an unfaithful bitch, and to that, one with a warped sense of humor?
That's something we all know and have experienced ourselves. Some more often than others.

Dice luck is dice luck, and something that cannot be helped. You can stake oyur odds in your favor however you want, and unless it is an unopposed roll at 20 or better, you can still fail or be out-rolled. And then come the saves.

 

Freak wars is in September here in Spain, and corvus is official sponsor, so maybe there will be some news there

 

Also take a look at your table setups and make sure you have some blocked sight lines across the table. There shouldn't be 100% cover all the time, but if there are NO avenues to work your way up the board (even at the cost of many orders) then it's easy to see how MSV-linked-sniper-types could completely dominate.