And the Jujak brings his own suit of nice gadgets. Tinbot, HFT and breaker ammo are all nice to have.
I would drop the Hwarang and add the two Boarding shotgun options. ────────────────────────────────────────────────── 5 1 HAETAE (BS Attack [Guided]) Heavy Rocket Launcher(+1B) / Assault Pistol, PARA CC Weapon(-6). (1.5 | 37) DOKKAEBI (Hacker, Killer Hacking Device [UPGRADE: Spotlight]) Combi Rifle, Pitcher ( ) / MULTI Pistol(+1B), PARA CC Weapon(-6). (0 | 25) SULYONG (Paramedic) Submachine Gun ( | MediKit) / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 23) JUJAK Boarding Shotgun, Panzerfaust ( | TinBot: Firewall [-6]) / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 28) JUJAK (Engineer, Deactivator) Boarding Shotgun, Panzerfaust, D-Charges ( | GizmoKit) / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 30) 1.5 SWC | 143 Points Open in Infinity Army
Apart from the problem that you have to prox at least two Ye Mao (or be lucky or crazy enough to lay your hands on two limited ones) I am not sold on the ML. Mime and MSV will help, but with only one wound a linked HMG will blow your 29 pts guy off the table in most of the cases. You still shoot on 12. Jujak will to the trick withouts mods but with 2 W and extra ARM for 4 pts more, wich are well invested in my opinion. Active turn ML are always a little bit gambling. Zhayedan or Bolts can try that. Ye Mao ML is profile that I will not miss a lot. Btw. the way CB provided us the Ye Mao was not nice. I got the lim.ed. anyway because I play SWF also ;-) but I understand the people that don´t want to invest 70+ € to get their hands on that Ye Mao. We still did not see a regular release. Only the Hacker (with sword for no reason - I replaced it with a spare medikit filed down to a pistol) was offered as a blister. Together with the Spitfire it would made a good box of three...or since the SF was in Beyond and mixed boxes are the new thing, the forgotten Jujak engineer. But no.... Again we have to prox very hard here: Apart from the Dokkaebi none of the profiles are available. And why the double - non existing - BSG? A combi would be the best filler rangewise. I would go with a Haetae HRL proxy, Dokki, Sulyong paramedic proxed by LSG, Jujak Breaker Tinbot (the only one where I do not care about the correct combi ;-) and Hwarang for CC duty.
They got stronger, but the faction still is going to revolve around monk teams and your chosen main link. And its core problems of relatively poor Lt access and expensive CoCs didn't change, either. Vanilla access to the new toys is different, but it's certainly not any less effective than what their access in WB brings to the table. I would argue that they bring more, even. Sure, you're not stacking up sixth sense or tinbot bonuses (although you can take a Zhanying hacker for 6th sense), but you're better able to take advantage of the Dokibot's marker state access, there are avenues for a great measure of support that you can bring that White Banner cannot, and you're not leaning into it with half of your entire army list. Turn 0 repeater coverage and additional hacking presence is great, and vanilla has a much easier time leaning into that. White Banner's toys got quite a bit better, but their primary list-building challenges didn't really change. They're still a very top-heavy faction design with surprisingly limited command structure that trades very poorly in a game increasingly centred around hyper-efficient trade-pieces. With ITS15 being a massive middle finger to midfield skirmishers, which also happen to be some of our best source of specialists, the Dokibot is an enormous shot in the arm for vanilla in providing an affordable mobile specialist with decent gunfighting and a marker state, and that's before even getting into the hacking utility.
Setting aside the discussion of models not available. On Ye Mao, Missile Launcher if great for me as I tend to capitalize the Super Jump on units that have it, shooting from an unexpected angle is always an advantage. On the Jujaks fireteam I prefer for such a long range fireteam Panzerfausts over HFT.
Okay, but the links' much-increased utility isn't reduced by those factors either. You will ideally do all of the above. 2 Zanshi with one being Lt. one being a decoy is an easy out. Given cover from the paintrain link -and- a Monk haris on Turn 1 if you second, I'd much rather that than invest in CoC given all the other toys WB can pick up now. Speaking of the Monk Haris, having Gotta disagree with you there. I'd much rather move a really great link up the table with 3 orders than a single or duo specialist, especially when Infiltration is restricted as much as it is this season (good point you made below). These new WB links can really reply well to a range of threats, including CC warbands, better than solo specialists can. The Tinbot's particularly important for offensive -and- defensive hacking, and SS & TInbot is really needed to leverage that Turn 0 repeater coverage well without just getting your hacker picked off. A Zhanying just isn't going to survive a KHD attack from anything decent. As for additional hacking presence, my hacking build is the link hacker (Doki here) and a Guilang, seems like plenty of redundancy for it IMO. Using the link to advance and then sink the Spotlight using B2 Pitchers at +1 BS seems like a better use of orders as well IMO. White Banner's toys got quite a bit better, but their primary list-building challenges didn't really change. They're still a very top-heavy faction design with surprisingly limited command structure that trades very poorly in a game increasingly centred around hyper-efficient trade-pieces. Agreed. Annoying to see infiltrating specialists downgraded for the season, but there have been a -lot- of seasons where they ran the roost. If it's just for the season, I'm fine with it. It also makes a decent pain train even more worthwhile IMO.
Example list I'd really enjoy playing, has most of the basic WB toys if I'm not mistaken? Lacks a second decent gun, but guessing you could fit Lei Gong in here or something. Looks Fun GHRL PainTrain Monks ────────────────────────────────────────────────── GROUP 1 9 1 HAETAE (BS Attack [Guided]) Heavy Rocket Launcher(+1B) / Assault Pistol, PARA CC Weapon(-6). (1.5 | 37) DOKKAEBI (Hacker, Killer Hacking Device [UPGRADE: Spotlight]) Combi Rifle, Pitcher ( ) / MULTI Pistol(+1B), PARA CC Weapon(-6). (0 | 25) JUJAK Breaker Combi Rifle, Heavy Flamethrower ( | TinBot: Firewall [-6]) / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 30) HWARANG Light Shotgun, Panzerfaust / Pistol, EXP CC Weapon. (0 | 23) SULYONG (Paramedic) Submachine Gun ( | MediKit) / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 23) ZHANSHI (Lieutenant) Combi Rifle / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 11) ZHANSHI Combi Rifle / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 11) CHAĪYÌ Yaókòng Flash Pulse / PARA CC Weapon(-3). (0 | 7) LÓNG YÁ (Minelayer) Panzerfaust(+1B), Flammenspeer(+1B), Submachine Gun, AP Mines / PARA CC Weapon(-3). (0.5 | 17) GROUP 2 4 2 3 GŬILÁNG (Minelayer) Boarding Shotgun, Shock Mines ( | Deployable Repeater) / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0.5 | 27) GŬILÁNG (Hacker, Hacking Device) Combi Rifle, Shock Mines ( ) / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0.5 | 30) HÙNDÙN (X Visor) Heavy Rocket Launcher ( ) / Pistol, CC Weapon. (1.5 | 27) LIANG KAI Chain Rifle, Light Shotgun, Flash Pulse / Pistol, EXP CC Weapon. (0 | 21) SHAOLIN Chain Rifle, Smoke Grenades / Pistol, Shock CC Weapon. (0 | 5) SHAOLIN Chain Rifle, Smoke Grenades / Pistol, Shock CC Weapon. (0 | 5) 4.5 SWC | 299 Points Open in Infinity Army
They will come out. Give or take about 5 years. About the time we get a second Liu Xing and HRL Haetae .
The good thing about Finecast is that conversions are a lot easier. There's an excellent HRL Haetae conversion that's on the Infinity FB group, where the guy put a rocket pod on the raised arm. https://www.facebook.com/groups/igcinfinity/permalink/7386350521388221 Great conversion IMO, looks pretty easy. You could cut the HMG barrel off and have a credible S5 assault pistol too.
In my meta this is a very important thing. While this is right, it has to be some small jumps. 4" is not much. C+ would be more effective or 6_2 move like 70 % of the new TB guys. But I remember that I walked in an elevated postion with my Makhe ML haris to get some far away targets, so it has some benefits. But still I would prefer the AP Spitfre, the hacker and either the engineer or a Tian to keep it cheap. Flamethrowers are Jujaks signatur weapon! A Shang-Ji HRL, while more expensive, would also provide TA and a scary impact template. A PF is empty after one linked ARO shoot.
I usually play without proxy, I think the only thing I have proxied in N4 is the BS Guilang as a hacker in a tournament so I understand people not wanting to play with profiles that do not have miniatures. but on a theoretical level these are fireteams I employ. 6-2 would be great, but even a 2" jump with a S2 silhouette gives quite a battlefield advantage. They can be reloaded with a Pangguling nearby, and yes, HFT is a signature weapon, but, its a fireteam designed to be as far away from the enemy as possible.
And Ye Mao have been a fire team troop for years but they haven't made more of them. They could have just done three of them. While TB just gets a five man core in one box and has more troops that can be in it as well. I'll be surprised if YJ gets much more this year. If it wasn't for REF, they would have had the least new figures last year.
Isnt´t 2" the silhuettes hight? Then you can simply vault that. 3 of 5 are armed with short range main weapons. Reloading is another order spent for the team. If you don´t want to make use of the BSGs then why you take them anyway. Maybe we have very different way for fireteam building
An S2 Silhouette is 40mm tall, a bit under 2", so a model with Super Jump on top of a building can add 2"(+ its 40mm Silhouette) to the height it already occupies, that usually is enough to gain LoF to locations the model would not normally have access to. I would rather have the Panzerfaust and be an extra threat to armoured enemies, even if it is used only once, than have a rifle and a HFT and not be one.
That's exactly how I feel about it. I just ran a 5 man core with the HAETAE the other day with the Dokkaebi Hacker and a SULYONG parametic and UT was fantastic! I'm loving the new additions to WB.
I'm gonna necro this thread, because WB fireteams are so much damn fun. I immediately went to the Haetae/Dok classic when the reinforcement units dropped, but I've moved over to other options now. I actually still favour shangjesus on point, with Dok and a Jujak engineer haris. It costs a fair bit but chaiyi and monks let you go top-heavy in WB without much problem. I've also found the following to be a brilliant haris: Ye Mao: AP spitfire Sulyong: FO Tian Gou: jammer It's fragile but very punchy, gives a valuable NCO and the jammer has been dynamite every time I've run it. I tend to fake out Adil or a basic Jujak, to invite LT decap runs, which I then jam into the ground. I like having two shotgun pieces to trade with, as the Ye Mao is fine as a solo gun if need be. It pairs well with HI cores, bringing another speicalist, and msv (which is super important in the UK meta, can't speak for elsewhere right now; we're drowning in SP and BJC). I've also been frankly shocked by what i consider to be a hidden gem in WB: pure core Chung-Hee! In a cheapo zhanshi link he is a brilliant second gun when your aro goes down; he rocks what is effecitvely a BS15 B3 short-ranged HRL, for 0swc. He likes Blue wolf lists, as his wip14 engineering is clutch for manned tags. My opponents haven't really clocked his threat value, and he has done damage every game I've run him. Plus his repeater is really nice too, if you're running a Dok haris. My advice is give him a go, he rocks. I got into WB on a whim a few years ago and they've fast become one of my main armies. Fun, powerful, huge variety in list building, great theme, what's not to love? One big negative I noticed, however, is the death of the Ye Mao pure core. they're capped at 3 in a link now, which is a big shame. I gave them an outing and I had a great time. RIP.
I belive Ye Mao never got a pure core. Jujak as well without So-Ra. Now they can take Hwarang! Only took a couple years :(
At least you can take them IN a core. Karhus (same, but better BS) are limited to haris. Maybe 15 or 16 shooters with mime and msv are too much for the current metas ... and in next new (O-12) sectorial we see some troops this for half the price with some cherry on top.
