Spoiler: Vipera Pursuit Force Since all subforums already have their own threat and are not discussing our precious nomad reinforcement like it used to be with new nomad releases i decided to take the step and open a post to discuss. Since all is silent on nomad´s front I took my time and thought a little about what we´ve been handed and some thought came to my mind. Nomads finally got CoC. For what ever reason. 29 0,5 is quite an investment to think about, but the main point is: Nomads have CoC. Whilest I don´t feel the need of Kulak Payback units I think Marspiders and Casinos bring a lot of nasty stuff to the table. Spiders are fast, solid in CC (B2 MA1 CC23 can hit very safe with high rolls), can reach a lot of spots with C+ and bring interesting features with ´em: eng or paramedic, Panzerfaust and grenades. But the main selling point is everything within 8 inches. Forcing the enemy to either decide to dodge vs. B4 (or hard melee, in case they come in B2B) or trying to trade vs. a 16points unit with 2 Heavy Flamer. I guess the challange is to bring Marspiders close enough to the enemy, but after they arrive they can be very nasty. Casino Rounders on the other Hand seem to be the perfect mid-range units: Marksman plus MSV1 with mostly B3 shock weapons scream midfield-control to me. This unit seem to exist to kill everything what hides under a marker/mimetism and is lightly armored. With a pricetag comparable to Bolts or wildcats, but the offensive benefits of boths (but BS12) that seems quite nice. Kulaks are... good. BS13 plus mimteism -3 is a weaponplattform that can handle a lot of enemies with ease. Shotguns, Multi Pistols and SMG´s for shortrange, Burst 4 Combis for midrange and the HRL for the rough times. With keeping in mind, that these folks will rarely walk around on their own this is some serious high burst firepower, starting in the midfield. To me, the least interesting but defenetly not least valuable of the tripple. Now to the old stuff: Reinforcement solves one of the biggest problems of mine with Lunakhods: The tend to be low range bots but starting in the own DZ. A single shot Acrylat canon does not make them more viable. With reinforcements deployment rules the Lunakhod starts close to the midfield, dropping ck´s and beeing closer to the favourable costumers of flamer and boarding shotgun attacks. Will be interesting to see if that makes the Lunakhod more viable and a more common sight. Lizard is imho together with Iguana the least useful TAG in our very big garage. The only interesting thing about him is the Grenade launcher, Because Gator seems to be the better Multi HMG plattform with all the same stats but better CC and defense over all, and Szalli is ... well...just great with HRMC. Also Killer hacker Pilot. Don´t see Lizard in his current state hit the table more often. Tsyklon, Stempler and Volstok, all with AVA2 makes a fun option to run a Core Link with 4 REMS and a eng-Marspider to keep up with them and deliver the sweet sweet repear option. I think about Eng-Spider, 2 Stemplers for TacAwarness, Volstok and Tsyklon either with FB for long range or Spitfire if I want to B5 anything. Prowler, tbh, is the most interesting unit in this roster to me; a FTO-prowler means he is loosing at least CAMO-state and Hidden deployment, and due to the nature of reinforcement, most likely infiltration aswell. Whats left is a Mimetism -3 unit with BS 12 unit with fairly interesting loadouts (cimbi, spitfire, BS, flamer, ADHL) that has to compete with the Rounder. Without any intersting changes or additional loadouts special for the FTO I don´t see this one having a spot on my dropship. But let´s see what happens on August 3rd. All the other units seem fine to me, Jelena is one of my most favourite Charakters due to her beeing constantly underestimated, raoul spektr is way more interesting to me as AD-unit and spektres are fine but expensive. I think that will be interesting to see how infiltration will work with Reinforcement. These are my couple of thoughts. With the full release standing on our doorstep there will be way more to speak about in the near future.
Some people I know agreed with me, that it is fine. Nothing terrible, and we are not leaving the game while nomads have no sepsitor. To the point! Only Marspiders got my attention. I really want to see, how they would look. What would be design decisions for them. And I would compare them with Van Saar gang from Necromunda in this aspect x)
Given neither Gator nor Zsalamander come as reinforcements, if one wants a TAG to come as reinforcements then Lizard is the only option.
That doesn't make it good though. It only means we're not bringing a TAG. I'm still really sad they didn't give her anything with the Bakunin update, such a missed opportunity.
that´s basicly what i feel aswell. Just because it is the only Tag in reinforcement does not make him better. One could argue that he is safe from alphastrike and starts in ideal range for the Grenade launcher, but he also starts closer to the enemy, with not even a DTW to defent itself from anything closer than 16 inches. The best CQB defense the GL-lizard has is the pilots SMG. I mean, beeing able to link with an engineer (like Stigmata. And Gator. And Iguana. And Gecko. ....actually every TAG except Szalli come with his own eng...) is a neat thing and i guess i will run the Lizard just for the lols, especially with a new Model on the horizon. And he is, ofc, maybe on the weaker end of the nomad-TAG-spectrum, but still better than every of the walking scrapmetal junkboxes the other factions call their military masterpieces.
And I'd say, let's wait and see what Lizard TAG comes up tomorrow. Because it may just as well differ pretty significantly from the one that is in the Army today.
but won't they get a discount for losing infiltration and camo? the Igao for tohaa lost camo and infiltration and got a 10pts discount for their reinforcements profile.
This is why I don't think some existing troops are going to get any sort of discount. Only those that have lost skills like Camo and Infiltration have gone down in points. Odalisques went up in price for example.
Went up in price because they got extra skills, the Reinforcement Odas has both 6th sense and 360 IIRC. Looking at what happened with the Squalo I'm fairly confident the Lizard is going to see an altered profile as a reinforcement (and maybe when taken normally too)
Why? a TAG is a TAG a TAG supported by a Marspider in the middle of the table is even more terrifying. But yes, I will agree, you should wait for the August 3rd release.
I wouldn't count on being able to use TacAware on the 2 Stemplers. Doesn't ITS ends in September ? If a player absolutely wants a TAG, a lizard is certainly an option but an equally valid option would be to simply play a different faction for that one game/one tournament where you feel a TAG is a must-have to the mission line-up. Like, when I feel like I want to use TAG, I avoid playing ForCo or StarCo.
Problem you're gonna have is orders for a tag, obviously all the details come out tomorrow but from what we've seen, reinforcements are in their own group and might not turn up till turn 3
I am hoping its an army error as that is a huge difference between the normal and reinforcement profiles: Army Error? ────────────────────────────────────────────────── GROUP 1 2 2 LIZARD (BS Attack [Shock]) AP Spitfire, Grenade Launcher(+1 Dam), E/M Mines / CC Weapon. (1.5 | 68) LIZARD PILOT Submachine Gun, D-Charges / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 0) LIZARD (BS Attack [Shock]) AP Spitfire, Heavy Flamethrower, E/M Mines / CC Weapon. (1.5 | 68) LIZARD PILOT Submachine Gun, D-Charges / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 0) GROUP 2 2 2 LIZARD REINF. Spitfire, Grenade Launcher(+1 Dam) / CC Weapon. (1.5 | 64) LIZARD PILOT Submachine Gun, D-Charges / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 0) LIZARD REINF. Spitfire, Heavy Flamethrower / CC Weapon. (1.5 | 64) LIZARD PILOT Submachine Gun, D-Charges / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 0) 6 SWC | 264 Points Open in Infinity Army
Reinf Lizards have BS attack(shock) in their profiles not options. They don't have the AP ammo though.
Reinf Lizard lose AP on the Spitfire and loses EM Mines. For 4Pts. Regular Lizard for 4Pts less swaps MHMG for AP Spitfire+EM Mines and gain BS Att(shock) on AP Spit, GL/HFT. I'm not too excited about AP Shock Spitfire, I feel the MHMG is still better even if it is only AP or Shock in active turn. It has better range; and reactively it is still EXP ammo. On Reinf though, the less expensive Spitfire is better as you are not using it to dispatch long range ARO anymore, at that point in time.
Meh... it's ok but far from loveworthy. ECM: Hacking (-9) on the other hand though? That would get love (and spark rage in all other factions)! Or E/M Drop Bears instead of the E/M-Mines
The Reinf. Lizard is interesting enough for me to give it a try. AP Spitfire with mines and a Shock-Flamer sounds like the sick shit i wanna try. Begone, pesky little dogged warbands. I like what the spektres can bring to the table, especially the MULTI MMR, although i am a little scared by the SWC. I also like this Mini-battle-REM what the Stempler Zond has become: B4 Combi rifle (B5 in harris) is nothing overwheelming, but unexpected at least. Just struggling with the Prowler. I dont see the use in them besiodes the TacAwerness order. Spitfire is a serious investment for a single Wound unit, and all the other units have to compete with Kulaks. Maybe the Killer Hacker because BTS 6, but that does not seem to me like a amzing selling point.
