Yeah, the Kamau Sniper+4 mooks (or equivalent in other armies) is a bit abusive, IMO. Was talking with some of the gaming guys last night and one guy really doesn't like how some armies are all counting as one kind of trooper for fireteams (I think he's whining about Kazaks specifically, but I haven't looked and he didn't specify).
What I specifically dislike about Fireteams is this modern trend of proliferating Wildcard Troops. I get that you (addressing CB here) want armies to have many different Fireteams, but Wildcard Troops enable some really wonky combos, and confuse the hell out of the rules. You even had to FAQ them so people would understand that a Haris of Kamau must have an actual Kamau with Fireteam: Haris skill rather than Patsy who actually counts as an Orc so won't be able to create a Haris of Kamau.
What's complicated about no ARM cover bonus but extra ARM on troopers that need it instead? If anything it's simpler I think.
I guess I shouldn't be surprised this has reached 80 pages. I can't even find where I first made comments if I even did. I want is some re-organization. Rifle-Combi, Rifle-AP, Rifle-Marksman, Rifle-Multi, etc. One location for everything in a skill or equipment. I'd rather no nested styles. However if they must have them, put what's in them in parenthesis. Martial Arts (Courage, Surprise Attack, Stealth) Morat (Religious, Veteran L1) Make close combat the same as shooting but must be in base to base. I don't care how you do it. Just do it.
Aren't general mechanics already the same? Just different modifiers / burst and DMG derived from wielder PH (which makes sense).
Yes an no. I want them to bring CC scores back down under 20, but add burst. My suggestion would be is to change Martial Arts to add burst. Everyone starts with 1. But Martial arts L1 would be +1, MA L2 +2, etc. Then do something else for PH. Like having CCW dmg PH+1, or +2, or +3. etc. It could make for a whole bunch of cool new CC weapons. Then there's always special Ammo too. But again, this all would only apply in CC. For example: (I'm only guessing on the scores! It's just for example) Ajax and his Hammer. CC16, Martial Arts L1 (giving him +1 attack), CCW dmg PH (he already has PH16), EXP Ammo. You can still do things like Berserk. Of course Natural Born Warrior could have totally different rules too. McMurough: CC17, Martial Arts L2 (giving him +2 attacks), CCW +0 dmg (already high), DA+AP Ammo. Crane Agent CC15,Martial Arts L3 (giving him +3 attacks), CCW PH+2, DA ammo. You can have guys with High CC and no MA, high MA but low PH. etc.
Very much yes. CC currently is really swingy and luck-based. I'll never forget that time when my Makaul approached a Fusilier under Eclipse smoke and then rolled a 1, while filthy Fusilier rolled a 7 or so. What's the point in having all those extra CC points if in the end they are not making the combatant more proficient in CC?
Exactly! I've had nearly the same thing happen. You get a monk it CC finally after going across the table to then be shot in the face by a Ghulam pistol.
“Should usually win in CC" does not equate to "will always win in CC". The possibility of an outlier result will almost certainly remain in N4.
Absolutely nothing wrong about that. But I want the equivalent to shooting. CC feels like a totally different thing, but if they are closer to the same, it makes it easier to remember and easier to teach! Don't streamline for the hell of it ever, but do it where it works.
So we go from CC of 20+ dictating the worth of a melee unit to MA1+ dictating the worth of a melee unit. Can't say I'm a fan. If melee combat were to be reconfigured it should be with the aim of making melee tactically valuable for all units against most enemies - this doesn't mean the Fusilier has a chance of beating the likes of Shinobu by ceasing the impetuous and assaulting her in close combat, but the Fusilier should have fair odds of assaulting a Kanren if the need arise. -- The alternative, of course, is to introduce ammo that needs to be reloaded by spending a Short Skill, but... you know... overhead.
Yay, it's the "CC can be more reliable but feels more swingy as it lacks the tactile weight of a handful of D20s" conversation again. Then again, I'm of the opinion that CC should almost never be the best option for something like a Fusilier or ORC, their role is aS a rifleman and CC should only be attempted by those who are specialised in it. Troopers that aren't specifically built to be CC capable shouldn't be bringing knives to gunfights.
This is a complaint about crits more than about the current CC mechanics (crits being for practical purposes the only way melee experts get beaten in melee, and a fusilier rolling a 7 being a crit against a makaul). You took a face to face roll with a 95% chance of either going your way or at least not going against you, but it didn't work out. That's luck based only inasmuch as anything in infinity carries a small risk of lethal variance thanks mostly to the crit mechanic. (Tactically speaking you could have insured further against this by giving the Makaul a gang-up bonus, which elevates them from merely quite good at melee to truly lethal, but I assume under the circumstances something stopped that from being an option.) CC played well is currently the second-most insanely reliable attack option in the game (after smoke shooting within 8"). Interestingly, as far as I can tell the change proposed earlier in the thread to reduce CC scores but increase burst would make it less reliable under a lot of circumstances.
Just for reference this would be a nerf to most current CC units, making them less reliable and more swingy in melee.
Edited my post - smoke shooting within 8", just because it can be done endlessly for no risk. Melee can abuse the same ARO manipulation if it's done in a link, but only once per engagement. However nothing matches melee for lethality per order.
Care to elaborate? Last I checked, a Zhanshi had decent chances of putting wounds on most of the game's units with their rifle. Same can't be said for their knife and they're meant to be decently trained at melee.
Zhanshi are not decently trained in melee, not anywhere close. They have slightly more training than a Fusilier or Ghulam, but nothing been approaching "decently trained".
