Yeah, it's a screaming frustration to a lot of us. Infinity really needs a technical writer with a big attitude to make all the rules match the same format. Examples are just that, no a place to look for rules. This may require adding a few new keywords and states and whatnot...
I had forgotten the whole discussion about how using laser/silhouette to check LoF is "mesuring" in the sense of the rule (and so forbidden) or just a gaming aid (and so allowed). Would be nice to have this settled someday...
I agree; however, after several big argument threads, debate on the topic is officially discouraged. It's not something that we can settle definitively.
I mean, It cant be measuring, but that aside, shrug, CB hopes it goes away. but is pro-LOF is open at their own events so shrug.
If you mean ‘some players choose to play that way in their games’, sure. The Interplanetario as an event is neither pro nor anti.
Like I said, if the two players in a game play that way then they play that way. There is no blanket ruling on it.
My apologies for not seeing where you said that. I reread the thread. I must be missing where you said it the first. time.
Sorry, it's in the first post that you quoted. Some players choose to play that way in their games, if both players agree.
Sure it is. All it takes is a statement from CB along the lines of, "As long as it is not a laser measuring device, the use of laser pointers and silhouette markers IS NOT PRE-MEASURING." End of discussion. There are laser tape measures. Kinda tempting to get one since they're not hugely more expensive than a regular tape measure, but that gets into the whole pre-measuring issue.
Yeah, sure. I said we cannot settle it. CB could make a formal statement either way, because they get to define the rules.
Wait, are you saying that even within games at the event that CB literally runs themselves, that players are playing with different rulesets from table to table? Because that's insane, and I have no idea how it's never caused major problems before
It reinforces that they mostly view it as an etiquette issue rather than a rules issue. The Order/ARO mechanic still works fundamentally the same, it's just a question of how precise of control individual players allow themselves to exert over it.
As Mahtamori says, it’s not run by CB, although these days most of the organisers have become CB employees. It’s also largely a non-issue as players are far better at discussing things and coming to an agreement at the table than they are online - and that assumes that there’s even a situation in the game where there are targets close enough for it to be an issue.
I don't want to flame the discussion but it think it should be so simple if it use rules like in guildball: 1 - you can ask anything open info. 2 - you must use a marker or a base to ask ... things like .. from here do you agree that I can see this mini and the one on the side can't see me ? ( slice) 3 - the active player should check with the marker which minis Has ARO to him. After checked he can confirm: this mini has LOF to this marker ( silhouette) ? 4 - when you place the mini it's done. You can't take it back. 5 - wide questions should be avoided: like - from here wich miniatures can see me ? - that's why the marker is ... the active player should look by himself. 6 - be explicit in what you want to Know. Take your time to ask! There's two consumables in the game : time and orders ! Always play by the most beneficial way, the best local to arrive by AD, the small path to accomplish a task is time consuming. It should be made by the active player. To play by intent like I have seen, there's no way to ARO without create problems. Because the full order should be explained before, and doing this you just skip the ARO declaration. I only have a not so good game once, and always play by intention. But CB is to slow and to egocentric ( no offense mean) to give some community members or playtesters the liberty to FAQ it and others things in a faster way. People have been criticizing fatality L2 since the beginning, only now we had a answer that it will be changed, it is on the radar.... Sorry to spit it out. I don't want to offend anyone but CB must put a closer look in tournaments games, and put it "rules clear". I just can speak for me and my city, but what will heapens if I don't want to play PBI and the only source of game in my city is PBI ? Or even worse, explicit in my case, when I accept the Limited PBI like I have illustrated above, and my opponent and TO says NO? Should I stop playing? Go to a new game just because the rules are not explicit? Thanks and sorry for any inconvenience
That doesn't sound as PBI, in fact PBI should create less problems in ARO than PBM and be quicker... Even as much as I'd like to see the rules of this game getting some deserved love, giving the community the ability to touch them as they wish isn't a good idea. I don't think the state of the rules is because they are egocentric or slow; but sadly the reason is the rules are like the last of their priorities right now (because reviews of the rules don't give money, miniatures and boxes do). But I think the overcomplicated and imcomplete rules we have now are keeping away a lot of players, however they don't seem to think the same. They are the ones who should fix the rules, and here in the forums they have a tremendous ammount of feedback when they decide to do it. About the PBI/PBM thing, I think it's ok the players have the possibility to choose their style. PBI is quicker and better for new players; PBM is harder and require more time. It's up to the players. Just be clear before starting the game about what is ok and what is not. Hellois confired they are looking at it in a thread in the rules forum some months ago.
He didn't confirm they are changing it, he confirmed they would look at it. Not quite the same thing.
