Not a problem if it's a warband... you just loose one regular order at most, usually one irregular one (so the only "risk" would be for your troop to not be able to get extra orders from the pool). I would have zero issue about doing that to anything tying down a target twice its costs in points or more. For example, a Morlock meleeing a TAG, then my Heckler spamming the Jammer... (specially since that TAG is locked doing nothing until the Heckler gets removed...)
Added to the unsolved list with the following description (correct me if necessary) : Situation : A viscious Heckler try to use his jammer to hit Achilles. Achilles is currently engaged with a morlock. Does the heckler's jammer ignore the -6 mod for BS attack into CC ? Answer : 1: Yes. The -6 mod for BS attack into CC is a visual mod so the jammer ignore it 2: No. The trait that seems to give Jammers the ability to ignore mods is 'No LOF'. Since there's nothing in either the Jammer or BS Attack into Close Combat rules that indicates LOF is a factor in why the MOD is applied ergo it LOF is not a factor and the MOD should be applied as normal.
Alternate correction for #2: “No. The FAQ specifies that No LoF means that ODD, Camo, and Cover are ignored (in two separate answers). The modifier for Engaged isn’t negated by FAQ.”
Can we not ask this question and instead ask whether the ODD MOD applies? Because you can ask exactly the same question and answer 2 is valid with what the rules say. So ask: Situation : A viscious Heckler try to use his jammer to hit Achilles. Does the heckler's Jammer ignore the -6 mod for ODD? What other MODs does the Jammer ignore and why? Because that's the actual issue. We don't know why Jammers ignore ODD so we can't generalise that.
They say it's because it doesn't require LoF - but nowhere does it say that that's the case, and some attacks that don't require LoF (like someone retaliating with SSL1 in their ZoC) are widely thought to not.
Nah. CB just realeased a Jammer+ in a form of unlimited eraser. So we are on the opposite side of "jammer need to burn in fire".
I've said it before and I'll say it again. The problem isn't Jammers, it's the Isolated state. Shift that to reset-out instead of repair-only and it'd immediately sort the problem.
Agreed! Yeah, that's probably the better question to ask! Make it dual level like Immobilized. ISO-1 you can reset out of, ISO-2 requires an engineer to fix.
Yeah my only hope is for a amended isolated state. Also, eraser doesn't have intuitive attack, so is already an improvement.
The why is an interesting question but the fact that ODD is ignored by jammer is in the FAQ : When performing an Attack with a Jammer, is the roll affected by the negative MOD of ODD or Camouflage, for example? No, in the case of an attack that does not require LoF, the negative MODs are not applied. I added a follow up question (feel free to rewrite it) : Follow up question : can we have a more detailed explaination of what is a "visual mod" and how "No LOF" weapon are allowed to ignored them
I completely forgot about that. Cheers. My memory of what's been decided by FAQ and what's been decided by forums has started to blur recently :) In light of that I change my answer from my second post. We do know because only mods that are derived from Camouflage (Mimmetism, Camo and TO) and ODD are referenced in the FAQ. The MOD from BS Attack into CC is neither of those things, so it is not ignored. Case resolved?
Gets covered by the fact it is a MOD that is literally defined by the LOF of the attack (same as Low Vis and Poor Vis Zones), which Jammers do not have. The FAQ only covers MODs that aren't defined by the LOF of the attack. We have an entirely reasonable answer that is both supported by the rules and is great from a Gameplay POV. Why do we need to ask CB about this one? It hasn't been an issue any other time it's been raised.
Jammers don't immobilise, they isolate. Isolate has two primary functions; kicks you out of a Fireteam and immediately stops any and all order expenditures on the affected unit (not too dissimilar to a Stun). I argue that destroying comms equipment like Hacking Devices is of lesser importance. For a model's ARO capabilities it has no real effect (unless Comms Equipment, of course). I think 1-turn duration is a good starting point considering the additional effects it has. How would resetting work on a unit that you can't spend orders on? Would it be essentially Entire Order Reset?
The unit cannot spend orders from the reserve, thus why it's mentioned it can't spend more orders. Unless it has an irregular/Lt one not yet spent. Anyway, on the next turn, or as ARO, the troop can Reset
