Quick feedback: I've used the first of @Phlyk 's lists for a few test games and it works really well for me. Thanks again for posting! Outside of maybe a few missions, I think I'd be comfortable always playing this list. Did anyone encounter any faction match ups that this list doesn't fare well with? I feel like I'd want to have a second list that features a CoC to avoid impersonator 1st turn LT assassinations. Spoiler: LIst Leipzig Test V3 ────────────────────────────────────────────────── 10 SOPHOTECT Combi Rifle, D-Charges / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 31) YUDBOT Electric Pulse. (0 | 3) YUDBOT Electric Pulse. (0 | 3) PROXY Mk.1 Hacker (Hacking Device) Combi Rifle, Nanopulser / Pistol, Knife. (0.5 | 14) PROXY Mk.2 MULTI Sniper Rifle, Nanopulser / Pistol, Knife. (1.5 | 24) PROXY Mk.5 (Forward Observer) 2 Submachine Guns, Nanopulser, E/M Grenades / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 10) CSU (Specialist Operative) Breaker Combi Rifle, Nanopulser / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 15) DAKINI Tacbot HMG / Electric Pulse. (1 | 21) DAKINI Tacbot MULTI Sniper Rifle / Electric Pulse. (1.5 | 21) DEVA Lieutenant (Sensor) Combi Rifle, Nanopulser / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 24) DEVA (Multispectral Visor L2) Spitfire, Nanopulser / Pistol, Knife. (1 | 33) DART Submachine Gun, Viral Tactical Bow, E/M Grenades / Pistol, Shock CC Weapon, Knife. (0 | 34) DASYU Hacker (Killer Hacking Device) Combi Rifle, Nanopulser / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 37) NAGA Hacker (Killer Hacking Device) Combi Rifle, Antipersonnel Mines / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 30) 5.5 SWC | 300 Points Open in Infinity Army
Glad you got on well with it, I think it's a really tight list! Can I ask which missions you played and against which factions? In hindsight, I'd probably consider something like this for my second list. It squeezes a linked Missile Launcher into the list and gives Chain of Command, but lacks a Hacker to buff the Remotes. I don't think it's quite optimised. I can see reasons to take an Asura Hacker instead, but then you'd want a Repeater near your Dakinis and then would need other changes again and so on. Also a toss up on whether the Proxy 1 should be a Doc or an Engi though. Probably an Engineer if I'm honest. Operations Subsection of the S.S.S. ────────────────────────────────────────────────── 10 ASURA Lieutenant L2 Spitfire, Nanopulser / Pistol, AP CCW. (2 | 72) SHUKRA (Chain of Command) Boarding Shotgun, Nanopulser / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 25) DAKINI Tacbot HMG / Electric Pulse. (1 | 21) Rebot SAMEKH FTO Missile Launcher / Electric Pulse. (1.5 | 17) DEVA (Multispectral Visor L2) Spitfire, Nanopulser / Pistol, Knife. (1 | 33) DEVA (Forward Observer) Combi Rifle, Nanopulser / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 24) CSU (Specialist Operative) Rifle + Light Shotgun, Nanopulser / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 12) PROXY Mk.1 Doctor (MediKit) Combi Rifle, Nanopulser / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 10) YUDBOT Electric Pulse. (0 | 3) PROXY Mk.5 (Forward Observer) 2 Submachine Guns, Nanopulser, E/M Grenades / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 10) DASYU Hacker (Killer Hacking Device) Combi Rifle, Nanopulser / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 37) DART Submachine Gun, Viral Tactical Bow, E/M Grenades / Pistol, Shock CC Weapon, Knife. (0 | 34) 5.5 SWC | 298 Points Open in Infinity Army
So far, I've only played Biotechvore and Supremacy both vs. StarCo. In Biotechvore, I found the list to work out well enough, even though I would prefer a dedicated list with a more close range focussed link. But there is certainly enough infiltration etc. to make it work. In Supremacy, the list felt really good and the Sophotect was amazing at minimizing casulties. For the second list, I could see something like this: Operations Subsection of the S.S.S. ────────────────────────────────────────────────── 10 ASURA Lieutenant L2 Hacker (Hacking Device Plus UPGRADE: Redrum) MULTI Rifle, Nanopulser / Pistol, AP CCW. (0.5 | 78) DEVA (Multispectral Visor L2) Spitfire, Nanopulser / Pistol, Knife. (1 | 33) DAKINI Tacbot HMG / Electric Pulse. (1 | 21) DAKINI Tacbot MULTI Sniper Rifle / Electric Pulse. (1.5 | 21) DAKINI Tacbot Paramedic (MediKit) Combi Rifle / Electric Pulse. (0 | 15) CSU (Specialist Operative) Rifle + Light Shotgun, Nanopulser / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 12) PROXY Mk.1 Engineer Combi Rifle, Nanopulser, D-Charges / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 10) YUDBOT Electric Pulse. (0 | 3) YUDBOT Electric Pulse. (0 | 3) PROXY Mk.2 MULTI Sniper Rifle, Nanopulser / Pistol, Knife. (1.5 | 24) PROXY Mk.5 (Forward Observer) 2 Submachine Guns, Nanopulser, E/M Grenades / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 10) LAMEDH Rebot Flash Pulse, Sniffer / Electric Pulse. (0 | 8) SHUKRA (Chain of Command) Boarding Shotgun, Nanopulser / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 25) ARJUNA Shock Marksman Rifle, D-Charges / Breaker Pistol, Knife. (0 | 37) x2 KIRANBOT E/Marat, Cybermines / Electric Pulse. (8) 5.5 SWC | 300 Points Open in Infinity Army It has the proper support for remotes in terms of Engineer, Hacker and Repeater, but lacks the infiltration. This could especially be interesting in missions with an exclusion zone. The Arjuna could be replaced with a Daysus KHD if thats more to taste, but I was thinking for Rescue or something similar it might be nice to have some expendable bots to build up area denial in regions where the ARO pieces can't see into.
Yeah that seems decent and might well be better than my one, although I would personally take the Dasyu KHD (or Dart depending on missions) instead of the Kiran and I'm not a huge fan of flashbots although I recognise they are popular. I'd also seriously consider the Samekh FTO option instead of the MULTI Sniper Dakini. Missile Launchers simply win games sometimes, and I'd consider making the same replacement in my first list and use the extra points for (yet another!) Yudbot or something or in your to give the CSU a Breaker Rifle maybe?
The Samekh FTO is interesting, BS15 B2 is certainly scary and can win games. But I acutally used my Dakini sniper quite a bit in the active turn to take out targets that aren't in good range for the HMG. Loosing Mimetism and +1BS -1B make that a bit harder. But then again success will likely kill whatever was hit so it can't be doctored up. I guess I'll give it a try, but I think how much utility is in the unit would be more interesting to me than to save 4 pts. Do you generally prefer the Breaker Rifle CSU? I see the appeal of getting a gun thats relatively good against hard targets, but getting a Shotgun into the link for offensive use as well as defensive use seems preferable in most list builds to me. Even against Invincibles the Breaker Ammo doesn't seem to help that much as most of them are roughly ARM3 BTS3 (as long as they don't field the Guijia, and even bad against a Rui Shi with ARM 0 BTS 6 etc.). But in general I haven't seen any TAGs at Tournaments in a while so this might be a meta thing.
I guess the main utility of the samekh is not to kill the target (as you said, the MSR would likely do the same), but to kill things around it. Especially things on total cover. Fireteams don't like templates :)
My point about killing it was more to say that there is a high chance of putting it to death instead of unconscious (especially looking at TR bots or HI on ARO duty). Do you often get to shoot and hit things in total cover with a Samekh? I feel that for the most part, he is going to engage ARO pieces on long distance shots at a stage of the game, when everything is still deployed orderly and the opponent made sure to not get two link team members in one blast template. I tend to get those kinds of shots with more mobile pieces like Phoenix who can march onto a building in the midfield and shoot at weird angles. Or do you sometimes catch people by keeping the Samekh as your reserve model to lure them into a false sense of security when deploying?
Breaker Rifle shreds Ariadna and TAGs, which is nice, and the link I tend to run lacks high burst stuff at 0-8" typically. Although the shotgun is also a perfectly viable choice and having an impact template is very handy. Exactly this! It keeps the opponent honest and forces them into worse deployment positions. MULTI Snipers win face-to-face rolls but Missile Launchers win battles! If the list didn't have the Proxy 2 Sniper then I'd probably take a MSR Dakini still, but when it's your second sniper thigns are less clear cut.
It does not change much in fact. B3 DA MSR means up to 6 dam 15 wounds. B2 ML means up to 6 dam 14 wounds ignoring cover ARM. If you add assisted fire (shock), few targets have real chances of surviving it. I'm not using that many templates except mines, the reason beside it is in my meta, we mostly play 10 orders lists, so we have plenty of space to put our miniatures. But either way, as long as your opponent knows you have big dangerous templates, he will have to spread his miniatures. That may force him to position in a few locations and avoid others that would have been better (ex. closer to an objective). Or force him to move conservately, because he does not want to pack his fireteam. Even if you can't shoot multiple targets, you can still find a benefit about it :)
I ran the list again today in Unmasking versus a really good TAK player. We both didn't commit any larger mistakes, so there was quite a bit of luck involved in me taking a big victory. While overall it went really well, I felt a bit like an Arjuna Shock Marksmen Rifle with two Kiranbots would have been a good replacement for the Daysus KHD. My deployment zone had a relatively large building that offered some really nice ARO spots, but that lead to a lot of my models bunching up. Since I was going up against TAK, I tried a layered defense to ensure that no Dog Warrior would get to do serious damage against my link. In this instance, that worked really well and the only casualties of the first round were a Proxy Mk5 and the Mk2 going into NWI. I fell though that depending on terrain, the Arjuna would have had a way easier time to cover the link, force more and earlier smoke throws and therefore free up other pieces to do be placed elsewhere. In that case, the Arjuna, Proxy Mk1, 1-2 Yudbots and the link would be on one flank, which should be enough specialists and firepower. Another reason for me wanting to switch out the Daysus might also be that he died to a shock round of an 16 pts. SMG Strelok, which didn't feel like points well spend. But here choosing the Daysus FO would have also helped to lay down some mines.
Thanks for the report. I can definitely see that an Arjuna would be a benefit in that kind of scenario and the E/Marats are great for slowing down dogs. What was the TAK list? I definitely agree that the weakness to shock feels pretty uncomfortable on a model that expensive, especially given the amount of Shock/Bio immune stuff that's available and the sheer amount of Shock damage that shows up in lists via Red Furys and SMGs. Maybe we can look forward to N4 where SMGs are costed properly. ;)
The TAK list was one combat group with ~5 line kazaks (2-3 FOs), Vet Kazak HMG, Frontovik HRL, Strelok FO, Irmandinho, Dog Face. Second group was Antipodes, Dozer and two 5 pts muls, SMG Strelok, Dynamo FO, Irmandinho, Spetsnaz AD with Rifle. On N4: I think keeping the cost of SMGs the same but putting them backt to AP only would help a lot.
