So I was thinking about how to approach something like Firefight, and this occurred to me: Military Orders ────────────────────────────────────────────────── GROUP 1 10 KNIGHT HOSPITALLER Doctor (Fireteam: Haris, MediKit) Combi Rifle / Pistol, DA CCW. (0.5 | 36) KNIGHT HOSPITALLER Lieutenant MULTI Rifle / Pistol, DA CCW. (0 | 35) KNIGHT HOSPITALLER HMG / Pistol, DA CCW. (2 | 39) ORDER SERGEANT Heavy Rocket Launcher / Assault Pistol, Knife. (1.5 | 15) ORDER SERGEANT Heavy Rocket Launcher / Assault Pistol, Knife. (1.5 | 15) ORDER SERGEANT Paramedic (MediKit) Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 15) ORDER SERGEANT Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 13) ORDER SERGEANT Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 13) TRAUMA-DOC (Father-Doctor) Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 14) PALBOT Electric Pulse. (0 | 3) DART Submachine Gun, Viral Tactical Bow, E/M Grenades / Pistol, Shock CC Weapon, Knife. (0 | 34) GROUP 2 4 1 SPEC. SERGEANT Hacker (Hacking Device) Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0.5 | 21) PATHFINDER DRONBOT Combi Rifle, Sniffer / Electric Pulse. (0 | 16) FUGAZI DRONBOT Flash Pulse, Sniffer / Electric Pulse. (0 | 8) MACHINIST (Father-Engineer) Combi Rifle, D-Charges / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 15) PALBOT Electric Pulse. (0 | 3) TECH-BEE (Remote Assistant Level 1, Specialist Operative) Flash Pulse / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 5) 6 SWC | 300 Points Open in Infinity Army Now I also have to thank the thread on Fireteams, which made me think about the Hospitaller Haris and Order Sergeant Core again. But, I like it. I think I ACTUALLY like it!
The point is… you guys play all armies in the same way. ARO defensive core + assault haris + some midfield control + second group with support tools. You could build a similar list with VIRD, NCA or ASA. Actually I could "Dashatinize" this list or build an equivalent with IA. All lists will look similar with only slight variations, so some armies will be able to bring slightly different tools but in the end we're all playing the same. It makes me wonder if this is way to play decided by the PanO community or it's actually the way imposed by the current ITS environment.
@AdmiralJCJF Obvious Lt in a Link that has to do all the work. Put it on the table, maybe against @Vaulsc 's Shas, I'm sure you'll notice some issues. Dunno, hardly anyone I know runs Haris Links. Assault duty is mostly a job for solo pieces with a Core Link providing a defensive Firebase and order battery.
Shock Army of Acontecimento ────────────────────────────────────────────────── GROUP 1 10 REGULAR (Sapper) MULTI Sniper Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (1.5 | 22) REGULAR (Sapper) MULTI Sniper Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (1.5 | 22) REGULAR Lieutenant Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 10) REGULAR Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 10) REGULAR Paramedic (MediKit) Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 12) ORC (Fireteam: Haris) Boarding Shotgun / Pistol, Knife. (0.5 | 36) LT. STEPHEN RAO Combi Rifle / Assault Pistol, Knife. (0 | 23) ORC HMG / Pistol, Knife. (2 | 44) DART Submachine Gun, Viral Tactical Bow, Antipersonnel Mines / Pistol, Shock CC Weapon, Knife. (0 | 34) TRAUMA-DOC Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 14) PALBOT Electric Pulse. (0 | 3) GROUP 2 5 PATHFINDER DRONBOT Combi Rifle, Sniffer / Electric Pulse. (0 | 16) FUGAZI DRONBOT Flash Pulse, Sniffer / Electric Pulse. (0 | 8) FUGAZI DRONBOT Flash Pulse, Sniffer / Electric Pulse. (0 | 8) FUGAZI DRONBOT Flash Pulse, Sniffer / Electric Pulse. (0 | 8) SCYLLA Hacker (Assault Hacking Device. UPGRADE: Icebreaker) Boarding Shotgun, Nanopulser + 1 Devabot Charybdis / Pistol, E/M CC Weapon. (0.5 | 30) DEVABOT CHARYBDIS Heavy Flamethrower / Electric Pulse. (7) 6 SWC | 300 Points Open in Infinity Army Yes @AdmiralJCJF I also like your list ^^
I agree with you too some degree, but there's still a lot of variation. In the last 12 months, across two seasons, I've run ITS-successful Acon Tikbalang lists, and NCA with nothing that starts outside the DZ. I usually don't use Haris at all (definitely not in Acon or NCA,) though Patsy's link has been growing on me. I actually dislike Haris, because I generally consider them a trap. Buying 3 Medium Infantry or 3 Heavy Infantry isn't always the best route. I like Patsy's Haris the most because it has the greatest flexibility of not buying 3-of-the-same unit type. As for a second group with support tools... That's definitely an ITS thing. My second group is responsible for the vast majority of my Objective Points scored, as well as a lot of my Classifieds. I can't imagine leaving it behind, and still running an ITS-viable list. @AdmiralJCJF MO is a PanO sectorial where I like Haris. Being able to control Frenzy/Impetuous is important, and unique to MO.
Rarely is the .5 SWC and the points tax for one non-specialist "elite" trooper worth the investment for that extra burst on your HMG/Spitfire. Haris teams need to offer something other than just an extra shot for it to be worth it in my eyes. 3 Bagh, 3 ORCs, 3 bolts, 3 Kamau ect. all of these lack flexibility and just eat up points for combi's you're never going to shoot. Canceling impetuous, a CC specialist getting "free movement", MSV mixing with non- MSV, a very good specialist in a button heavy mission, ect. These things make Haris teams more useful – Wilcard has worked wonders making them more viable for me. More specifically PanO has relatively weak Haris options outside of Patsy+friends and Hospitallers.
Which is a trap. MO doesnt have IA orders or order resiliaance, so at the end you want this frenzy. But you cannot have as you also need links firepower and order efficiency. The only gameplay in MO with impetues came from Magister who were most of the time linked and you could just milka bit of order efficiency with dissolwing link just before impeteus phase ( quite usefull if someone placed some nasty ARO for your link).
RTF has a strong MSV2 Haris link with the Muhktars, seen them in action they're actually pretty awesome. Bahram's main fighting link until the recent book was an Asawira Haris. ISS uses the Hsien in a Haris as an attack piece, JSA do Karakuri+Domaru. USARF use the Marauder Haris alot, Ikari use Brawler/Tanko to back up a Druze core... I could go on. Haris links are a thing for many factions. I mean shit @daboarder won Cancon using Patsy leading a Kamau Haris in one of his lists.
Whatever. Point is that Magisters works because they are X.Impetues. Frenzy doesn't work for linked guys as well... you want them linked because you paid for that and you don't have enough CT to constantly relink them, while you cannot make them frenzy because well they are linked and you want to leverage bonuses. Whole idea of linked frenzy troopers is hot garbage (and many people said about it) but we won't see this changed until N4 thats for sure. Plus I cannot see any hot MO lists in threads so... yeah. thats also quite telling.... Thank you for your MO input.
Frenzy is way harder to set up and benefit from than Extreme Impet – keeping your Hospitallers linked is always universally better unlinking them and potentially setting yourself up for an additional order the turn after, IF you kill something. I don't really see a debate here to be honest.
Nice for haqq to get two great linkable red fury msv2 options and smoke to combo it with. Would be nice to have either of those.
If you offer to trade these profiles I'm sure the Haqq players might consider it. Ramah Taskforce ────────────────────────────────────────────────── 1 TUAREG Sniper Rifle, Antipersonnel Mines / Pistol, Knife. (0.5 | 33) 0.5 SWC | 33 Points Military Orders ────────────────────────────────────────────────── 1 SPEC. SERGEANT (CH: TO Camouflage, Infiltration) MULTI Sniper Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (1.5 | 33) 1.5 SWC | 33 Points Everyone's got something up their sleeves.
