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Haqqislam in the age of 3rd Offensive

Discussion in 'Haqqislam' started by Errhile, Oct 16, 2018.

  1. oldGregg

    oldGregg Well-Known Member

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    But Moma Mags and those Asawira are so much fun!

    I had a lengthy conversation with my PanO buddy about this last week. I don’t the think we really need more shooters. Sure, not having them can really make a situation difficult, but we excel at using lots of units and trading up. I’d venture to say Haqqislam might be the best at this. It’s a different play style, but it definitely is not weak. Would I complain if we got a great shooter? Nah.

    I’m just perfectly ok without one.
     
    Errhile likes this.
  2. Fenrir

    Fenrir Well-Known Member

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    @oldGregg we are the only faction without shooters.

    the problem is that haqqi players dont complain at all, other factions are getting or had like 3 or 4 really really good shooters and we only have the maggy that all factions got similar one and asawira that hits 1 time and dont have cover any longer. The only goods are tariq (kawarj) cause the Fn2 and the Djanbazan with the mutta somkes (then i am hearing about mutta smokes are broken and they wanna take them off wtf, when other factions got some broken things too).

    I don't know if you go to tournaments, but I do and all the people there say that haqq is low tier, cause 1 or 2 mistakes, some bad dices and its gg wp. the other problem is the reactive link team with the Sixth sense L2 so dificult to take them down if you play fidays you cant go CC easly also if
    pairing is EC or toha and you go 2nd you can say bye bye to your fiday at first turn, or you must deploy extra defensive and its an assasin...

    (I will continue playing haqqislam ofc, is what I think)
     
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  3. Agorapocalypse

    Agorapocalypse Namurr and Nahab are girlfriends

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    Yeah, I know haqq isn't a straight shooter army, but we also lack other abilities to make us super tricky. I think our lack of RTF and QK being outdated leaves us in a weird spot for now.
     
  4. oldGregg

    oldGregg Well-Known Member

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    @Fenrir I wrote you a nice long response, but I think its better to just let you feel however you already do. I don't agree with you, and I'll end it at that.

    @Agorapocalypse I think we have a lot of the tricks. No ODD, which would be cool I guess, but what else would you say we're missing?
     
    #224 oldGregg, Dec 26, 2018
    Last edited: Dec 26, 2018
    Errhile likes this.
  5. Errhile

    Errhile A traveller on the Silk Road

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    You call it "the problem", I call it fantastic community. How many other factions started a culinary topic, huh?
    I said it long ago: Haqq seems to attract a very specific type of players.
     
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  6. Fenrir

    Fenrir Well-Known Member

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    I think that i dont explain myself very well.

    first of all i want to say that i'm not talking about community in my answers, that's another point @Errhile .

    second is that i am talking about balance in game. (And you would say that we got tricks and especial things, yes, but if we play against a player that knows haqqislam and knows the tricks we are already losing. for example the other know that we got muttas so he's deploy respect snipers would be for killing that trops that are a pain). If haqqislam were balance we would got something like an Azrail with full auto n2 for example, some kind of troop that can take down the strongest enemy troops. I would say "I take this troop cause I know its good for killings their strongest troops" then its the point that you would pay the points or not its all up to you. Or maybe you would spend your points for making a tricky list.

    In conclusion I think that haqqislam need something like kriza, veteran kazak, intruder with standar bs shooter that can kill people.
     
  7. Agorapocalypse

    Agorapocalypse Namurr and Nahab are girlfriends

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    In that case I think only tarik and the Ayyar count as our dedicated straight shooters. Maggy is just a cheap basic tag, and azrail is just a cheap big gun. Asawira could be a runner up if not for extra cc rules (which I prefer), and the zhayedan, khawarij, and lasiq try but are either overcosted or lack a certain edge.
     
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  8. sololobo

    sololobo Well-Known Member

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    I do think we are in for a faction update/boost. Why? Well, CB monitors tournament stats. For example, I downloaded all interplanetario lists and culled all non-haqq. I was left with 10 players out of lord too many! And, out of those ten there were zero QK. So, that should tell you something. lol And, even in these limited insertion lists they had several mercs...another telling thing. So, the bottom line is that I hope Haqq gets its day in the sun. And, here I an soon to AVA most of the faction...but, we will see. We will see.
     
  9. Xeurian

    Xeurian Well-Known Member

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    That just tells me they will most likely be taking QK out of the standard release cycle next/soon.
     
    oldGregg likes this.
  10. Palomides

    Palomides Well-Known Member

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    So pessimistic, arkadaş! I agree that we're likely to get a revamp soon, but I think we're overexaggerating Haqqislam weakness. We don't have many top tier gunfighter, but Tarik, the Spitfire Khawarij, and the Ayyar are all extremely dangerous. Linked Khawarij with B5 Fatality will be absolutely brutal.

    On top of that, we still have the Fiday. Not a gunslinger, true. But a pretty excellent way to resolve problems. Naffatun are an excellent, cheap template weapon justly feared by TO and ODD heavy factions, and I don't need to mention the mighty Mutt jammers! Daylami panzerfausts are some of the best speedbumps in the game. Etc...

    Haqqislam doesn't win through superior firepower like PanO, but by sticking with the mission. Drop smoke, advance carefully, and push buttons. Don't fight unless you have to.

    Again, I think we could use a faction rework in light of the Third Offensive changes. But that doesn't mean we're useless now.
     
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  11. Agorapocalypse

    Agorapocalypse Namurr and Nahab are girlfriends

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    Can we stop with the QK pessimism, only sectoral of factions with 4 sectoral were removed. There's plenty of room for haqq to have 3 sectorals and QK is likely going to get updated.
     
  12. HBS

    HBS New Member

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    k then Let's guess what is inside of RTF starter. i think 3 nafattun + 1 zayedan + 1 kawarij + 1 sth HI.

    with wildcard zayedan and haris of Kawarij. it can be good expansion start with RV
     
  13. LoganGarnett

    LoganGarnett Well-Known Member

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    Isn't Red Veil like RTF starter already?
    Anyways, I think Naffatuns are not likely to appear, unless they'll get some new loadouts (HRL? VULCAN SHOTGUN??? jk)
    If there's gonna be a new box for Ramah, I'm hoping for Spitfire or BSG Khawarij, one more Zhayedan (sniper, plz) and a new troop. Plus some cheerleaders, as always.
     
  14. Xeurian

    Xeurian Well-Known Member

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    Not pessimism, I don't consider the retirement of a Sectorial to be a bad thing as such nor do I consider QK to be in such a bad place. I also personally don't really have much of a horse in the race as I've very little interest in the Sectorial in question. I just consider it one of the next logical Sectorial choices in the lineup.
     
  15. Barrogh

    Barrogh Well-Known Member

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    I'm not sure if it's just a figure of speech, but just in case: Frenzied troops don't become Impetuous before their next Active turn after inflicting a wound. But yeah, if we are talking about removing turn 1 obstacles, that doesn't make much difference.

    And when you need an obligatory toxic member, you can always call me :P

    To be honest, it's not surprising that one of the closest things to "Zerg army" there is in Infinity doesn't see any serious play in Limited Insertion tournament.

    In theory, it should be easy to throw some LI lists for QK, but I guess you end up with something rather bland in the end. I'm surprised that nobody tried though. This doesn't sound good.

    As for shooting... There are not that many ARO pieces that can actually shut down both mutts and some random semi-decent guy with HMG. I can definitely see an issue with something like Varuna though.
     
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  16. KwarkyMats

    KwarkyMats Well-Known Member

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    The current vanilla Haqqislam starter is already intended to be RTF's starter. All the units in the starter (and the Red Veil exclusive Al Fasid) are Ramah troops. Kinda like how the vanilla Combined Army starter pack features Onyx troops.

    So, let's have some fun and speculate what new releases we could be getting!
    A Zhayedan box, considering 4 profiles don't have a miniature yet: Boarding Shotgun, HMG, Missile Launcher and Sniper Rifle.
    A Khawarij box maybe, 2 profiles, the Boarding Shotgun and Spitfire don't have a miniature yet. The Khawarij dossier shows a HRL loadout. That's 3 minis. 4 if you want to add in a separate doctor/panzerfaust mini.
    Which leaves two Tuareg profiles, the Boarding Shotgun and the doctor/generic rifle+shotgun, although you could say the hacker miniature already has that covered.

    All other profiles which belong in RTF already have miniatures and up to date sculpts. From the top of my head the oldest sculpts are probably Saladin, the Ghulam box and Rifle+Shotgun Tarik. And those are still looking fresh.
    So the only unaccounted for miniatures are new profiles and new troops.

    I keep forgetting about this rule. I tried my best not to hurt my opponents during a rescue mission with an Asawira to prevent him from going impeteous while carrying a civilian back. Would've made that game a lot easier :)
     
  17. Barrogh

    Barrogh Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, the reason I posted that is because I myself made that mistake early on.
    I guess the way to remember that rule in the future is to take note: you don't get direct drawbacks until you get benefits as well. So you only lose cover when you gain Impetuous Order.

    Also worth nothing that (IIRC) linked troops are considered as not having Frenzy at all, so you don't even begin to track damage they deal for the purpose of becoming Impetuous later.
    So if your linked Asawira kills stuff on your first Active Turn, then gets kicked out of link on your subsequent reactive turn (without inflicting any damage after that), you end up with Frenzied, but not Impetuous Asawira on your second Active turn.
     
    #237 Barrogh, Dec 27, 2018
    Last edited: Dec 27, 2018
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  18. HardDisk

    HardDisk Well-Known Member

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    Agreed, i play against some players that knows haqq tricks, but that doesnt stop the tricks from happening.

    Haqq is a competitive faction still, we learn not to rely on winning shoots to win missions and keep the eye on the price, otherway you will probably lose.

    But one good gunslinger for LI would be really nice =)
     
  19. Agorapocalypse

    Agorapocalypse Namurr and Nahab are girlfriends

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    I could see them going back on what they said and come out with a new Rama sectoral starter.
    I'd guess it could be like IA so... 3 khawarij, new zhayedan sculpt maybe, and 2 or 3 new units.
     
    oldGregg likes this.
  20. Errhile

    Errhile A traveller on the Silk Road

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    Mr. Mansuri*, is that you? ;)
    * Poison, you know :P

    I just don't play tournaments (and in fact can't see any merits in ITS missions), but that's my go-to list when I feel I can't think creatively on a given day.
    Qapu Khalqi
    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────

    [​IMG]10
    JANISSARY HMG / Pistol, CCW. (2 | 40)
    JANISSARY Akbar Doctor (MediKit) AP Rifle + Light Shotgun / Pistol, CCW. (0 | 41)
    JANISSARY Boarding Shotgun / Pistol, CCW. (0 | 31)
    JANISSARY Boarding Shotgun + 1 TinBot A (Deflector L1) / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0.5 | 32)
    JANISSARY AP Rifle + Light Shotgun / Pistol, CCW. (0 | 36)
    SEKBAN (Fireteam: Haris) AP Rifle, Chain-colt / Pistol, Stun Pistol, Knife. (0 | 22)
    SEKBAN Heavy Rocket Launcher, Chain-colt / Assault Pistol, Knife. (1.5 | 23)
    SEKBAN Lieutenant AP Rifle, Chain-colt / Pistol, Stun Pistol, Knife. (0 | 21)
    HAWWA' Hacker (Assault Hacking Device) Boarding Shotgun, D-Charges / Pistol, Knife. (0.5 | 26)
    SHIHAB REMOTE HMG / Electric Pulse. (1 | 25)

    5.5 SWC | 297 Points

    Open in Infinity Army


    Keep in mind the list can be tweaked to have:
    - ML in place of the HMG in Jannissaries,
    - Janissary Lt
    - something else instead of the Sekban Harris
    - something else instead of the Shihab.

    But the lynchpin here is a Jannissary Core with Doc (and I consider the Tinbot to be essential).
     
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