On the bright side, IA would have seen Zhanshi tested again. They found points to spare on Hospitallers, mayhaps Zhanshi have been looked at? They've never bothered me (much), but some people seem to really dislike the current Zhanshi price.
Take a look at Alguaciles. They've so far not touched on light units. It's mostly been TAGs and HI that's gotten a couple of points reduction. Hopefully this means the Guijia at the very least gets reduced to 85 points, but we'll see.
And I can tell you to your face that I don't argue in bad faith, since I don't remember the suggested alternative. Nor am I suggesting that all, or even majority of players awaiting IA were holding such views. Please take my comment at face value - simply that there were people arguing just that. There's no hidden intention behind it. Oh, I agree. As I've just replied to Mahtamori, I'm by no means suggesting this was a widespread position. Yeah, exactly. I'd really like to know how things like this come to pass :P They're a victim (though it's a strong word) of the old design and pricing philosophy. That 1 pts doesn't mean much when all's said and done, but such minor things can be really annoying. It's like the SWC cost of Regular FO. Ok, it's not something that keeps PanO players up at night, it's just... why?
I am also one of the people who wanted Zuyong engineers and docs. Because a Zanshi doc cannot casevac anything heavier! Both fluff-wise and rules-wise. I wanted a Zuyong Engineer for fluff. Funny, CB seems to think that the vision of the Invincible Army is one where almost every trooper is HI (every newly-introduced trooper is classed as HI!). And I think the Zanshi are still present to allow for more cheap orders. Chaiyi are only AVA2, and 8pt Baggagebots are competing with EVO or TR Combis for AVA, so that's probably a max of 3 orders in 24 pts. Dunno why someone would try to push 14 orders in what is an elite sectorial, but...
Exactly. The Zhencha is the troop profile that we have, better to positively look at that rather than what we otherwise could have had. Great objective grabber and defender, IMO.
Well, if you don't remember or didn't read it, then fair enough, but are you really in a position to judge the debate when you've not really read it? The core of the no-Zhanshi debate tended to offer as alternative either a Dakini-like or Chaiyi-like REM (or even just very high AVA on the current S3 REMs was floated) or wanted a Chinese Grunt (my favoured position). The key with sufficient number of overly-vocal people (hey, I'm a forum loud-mouth and I know it) was that there would be something in the low-points cost to fill up the gap because a very large number of IA units would require cheap units to act as fillers. That said, it is true that the Holy Grail is 10 models, 20 wounds, 10 orders and a complete set of tools: a doctor, an engineer, a HMG, a hacker, a killer hacker, and a missile/rocket launcher, you have to separate the nerfed-Zuyong hopes and dreams from the inevitable "let's make a 10-man list of everything that's the best and oh we're over 600 points and 20+ SWC..." that's not actual expectations. And I must say that insinuating that "some prominent people" like Admiral wrote means that he's basically just throwing dirt and that these "prominent people" can't really defend themselves against it or even explain why he's wrong or what he's gotten wrong. It's a dirty, dirty, style of arguing.
CGs got their BSG FO with HSN2, so there is still hope for Zhanshi getting something out of this book. Sent from my SM-G935P using Tapatalk
Yeah, but Zhanshi are complete, Celestial Guard needed that cheap specialist. All that you'd want from Zhanshi is a more fair points cost (or for that vaunted CC training to be useful)
I’d like to encourage guys to try playing with the new profiles this weekend. Either in a vanilla list or even try out the IA with what you know. I know we don’t have rules for the Explode, but just try it without it. See what these guys are like. I think we all know that no matter how things look good/bad on paper, when you have it on the board, things change. Some might feel like the Zhencha is not bad from what they thought, and others that it’s worse than they thought. But at least you can say you actually used it. This is my list for Friday night. I at least know Zuyong have Fireteam Core. So with some Wu Ming stand-ins I’m going with them. I’m going to use a Zhencha FO with SMG and the Liu Xing with Boarding Shotgun. First thing I notice with this list is how it’s going to be hard to play with all of my toys. Especially if you want a 5-man link of anything. If you don’t like some of the profiles, well you might not be able to fit them in anyway. If they are going to adjust points down a bit, I hardly see this whole list being more than 10pts cheaper. Tomorrow I’ll be playing against Haqqislam. Yu Jing (Invincible Army) ────────────────────────────────────────────────── 10 Zhencha (Forward Observer) SMG, D.E.P., Antipersonel Mines / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 34) Liu Xing Boarding Shotgun / Pistol, CCW. (0 | 32) ZÚYǑNG Lieutenant Combi Rifle / 2 Breaker Pistols, Knife. (0 | 27) ZÚYǑNG Paramedic (MediKit) Combi Rifle / 2 Breaker Pistols, Knife. (0 | 29) ZÚYǑNG MULTI Rifle / 2 Breaker Pistols, Knife. (0 | 31) ZÚYǑNG Boarding Shotgun / 2 Breaker Pistols, Knife. (0 | 26) ZÚYǑNG Missile Launcher, Light Shotgun / 2 Breaker Pistols, Knife. (2 | 36) PANGGULING Hacker (EVO Hacking Device) Electric Pulse. (0.5 | 25) SHÀNG JÍ Hacker (Assault Hacking Device) Combi Rifle + Light Flamethrower / Pistol, Shock CCW. (0.5 | 43) MECH-ENGINEER Combi Rifle, D-Charges / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 15) 3 SWC | 298 Points Open in Infinity Army
Can I see this thread calm down a bit? would be nice. Personally I really like the idea of 1W+NWI HI and wished MO had a few to keep the costs down, alas IA has the nice toys.
If you wouldn't have left half the quote out, changed fear for salt and if I gave a single fuck about SW... maybe?
Whelp, can't say the infos so far hype me for IA. At least there are a few profiles left to be announced, so I'll hold out hope. But I'll also be painting my Knights in the meantime. And I find it freaking funny that apparently nobody got Gutier's protrayal of Yu Jing correctly. Calm your tauntauns? Dewbacks? AT-ATs?
