Using Xenotech Engineer as a Human Shield

Tema en '[Archived]: N3 Rules' iniciado por Tongfa, 20 Sep 2018.

  1. Commoner1

    Commoner1 Well-Known Member

    Registrado:
    23 Nov 2017
    Mensajes:
    202
    Me Gusta recibidos:
    373
    Edited
     
    #21 Commoner1, 21 Sep 2018
    Última edición: 21 Sep 2018
  2. Mahtamori

    Mahtamori Well-Known Member

    Registrado:
    23 Nov 2017
    Mensajes:
    12.076
    Me Gusta recibidos:
    15.387
    Just a tiny bit of input on this from observations during game: not being able to place down mines and dodge when the Xenotech is prancing over the battlefield is very annoying. An infiltrating controller such as a Locust enables the Xenotech to complete their objective with minimum number of orders and zero risk on a large number of board layouts, but infiltration or forward deployment isn't even necessary if there's a sufficient hiding spot near the edge of the DZ.
     
  3. DukeofEarl

    DukeofEarl Well-Known Member

    Registrado:
    27 Nov 2017
    Mensajes:
    1.444
    Me Gusta recibidos:
    1.385
    Honestly hadn't considered ARO situations only active turn.
     
  4. ijw

    ijw Ian Wood aka the Wargaming Trader. Rules & Wiki
    Infinity Rules Staff Warcor

    Registrado:
    25 Abr 2017
    Mensajes:
    7.353
    Me Gusta recibidos:
    14.845
    How is the controller making a difference? It's the Xenotech that has to move far enough out of the Deployment Zone.
     
    A DukeofEarl le gusta esto.
  5. inane.imp

    inane.imp Well-Known Member

    Registrado:
    28 Ene 2018
    Mensajes:
    6.040
    Me Gusta recibidos:
    7.179
    More room to find cover within 4" outside of the DZ so you don't need to move to complete the objective.

    I agree though that it's hardly necessary. It still needs 2 Moves.

    Also, there's no reason that it can't be a Trooper in a Marker state state I'm aware of?
     
  6. colbrook

    colbrook Grenade Delivery Specialist

    Registrado:
    23 Nov 2017
    Mensajes:
    9.340
    Me Gusta recibidos:
    17.155
    The CivEvac State is cancelled if the controller is in a marker state.
     
    A DukeofEarl y ijw les gusta esto.
  7. ijw

    ijw Ian Wood aka the Wargaming Trader. Rules & Wiki
    Infinity Rules Staff Warcor

    Registrado:
    25 Abr 2017
    Mensajes:
    7.353
    Me Gusta recibidos:
    14.845
    The Xenotech only needs to keep Coherency with the controller, it's not going to make any difference to Order efficiency whether the controller is staying in Total Cover up-table or Total Cover within their Deployment Zone.
     
  8. inane.imp

    inane.imp Well-Known Member

    Registrado:
    28 Ene 2018
    Mensajes:
    6.040
    Me Gusta recibidos:
    7.179
    No it's cancelled if they enter a Marker state.
     
  9. ijw

    ijw Ian Wood aka the Wargaming Trader. Rules & Wiki
    Infinity Rules Staff Warcor

    Registrado:
    25 Abr 2017
    Mensajes:
    7.353
    Me Gusta recibidos:
    14.845
    From the Xenotech rules:
    • During the Deployment Phase, the Xenotech will be deployed in the CivEvac state, Synchronized with a trooper that meets the requirements to declare the Synchronize Civilian Skill.
    From the Synchronize Civilian Requirements:
    • Only models and not markers can perform this Common Skill. Any Marker which declares Synchronize Civilian is automatically revealed.
    My emphasis. I know it's not 100%, but it's going to be a stretch to claim that you can start the game with the Xenotech Synched to a marker.
     
  10. inane.imp

    inane.imp Well-Known Member

    Registrado:
    28 Ene 2018
    Mensajes:
    6.040
    Me Gusta recibidos:
    7.179
    How many interactions that are accepted as "the Rules" are based on interpretations that are - at best - described as "a stretch"?

    The cancellation clause is entering the state. Deploying in a state isn't entering a state.

    Cancellation clauses are king.

    Now an argument of "Yes you're correct that is what the rules say, but it's an obvious exploit so I recommend not doing it" I'd buy.
     
    A theradrussian y paraelix les gusta esto.
  11. ijw

    ijw Ian Wood aka the Wargaming Trader. Rules & Wiki
    Infinity Rules Staff Warcor

    Registrado:
    25 Abr 2017
    Mensajes:
    7.353
    Me Gusta recibidos:
    14.845
    Please point out where I said anything about cancellation clauses. That's a wild goose chase. :-(

    The Xenotech rules say that you can't attach the Xenotech to anyone who cant fulfil the Requirements to synch Civilians. As per the Synchronize Civilian Requirements, Markers can't synch Civilians.
     
    A RobertShepherd, DukeofEarl y inane.imp les gusta esto.
  12. Andre82

    Andre82 Well-Known Member

    Registrado:
    27 Dic 2017
    Mensajes:
    494
    Me Gusta recibidos:
    559
    Infinity is not about just simply winning...
    You must grind your enemy into the dirt and extract the best 10/0 points you can. Any game I don't take a full 10 points is a game that I failed and might keep me from first place!

    Sadly I am only a little joking. Twice now I was matched vs a newish player and as opposed to taking my time and helping him understand what was happening or mistakes he made, I had to simple and quickly farm them for points.
     
    A theradrussian le gusta esto.
  13. paraelix

    paraelix Seed Embryo Scholar

    Registrado:
    31 Ene 2018
    Mensajes:
    1.163
    Me Gusta recibidos:
    1.206
    Bold underline is my emphasis @inane.imp - a marker state could not declare the skill, so wouldn't be a valid selection.
     
  14. Mahtamori

    Mahtamori Well-Known Member

    Registrado:
    23 Nov 2017
    Mensajes:
    12.076
    Me Gusta recibidos:
    15.387
    The controller makes a difference due to coherency requirements and ARO geberation. If you have forward deployment of any sort it's much easier to put the controller in a hidden spot where it won't generate inconvenient AROs which will lead to the Xenotech mechanism being a dull order sink instead of a trade off of risk.

    That and it seems tailor made to punish lists with fewer orders.
     
    A Hecaton y Mruczyslaw les gusta esto.
  15. tox

    tox SorriBarai
    Warcor

    Registrado:
    21 Feb 2017
    Mensajes:
    3.695
    Me Gusta recibidos:
    3.691
    BTW, is there any restriction about other Sync?
    Can a Doctor with 2 Servant be appointed as Xeno-Nunny? A Chimera? A Kanren with Mad Traps?

    I didn't see any restriction about this...
     
  16. inane.imp

    inane.imp Well-Known Member

    Registrado:
    28 Ene 2018
    Mensajes:
    6.040
    Me Gusta recibidos:
    7.179
    Dr yes.
    Chimera no (due Impetuous).
    Moran with Koalas yes.
    Kanren in Holo 2 state and Madtraps no (due Marker state).
    Kanren in Holo 1 state and Madtraps yes.
    Puppetmaster yes.
    Apsara yes.
     
  17. xagroth

    xagroth Mournful Echo

    Registrado:
    23 Nov 2017
    Mensajes:
    6.621
    Me Gusta recibidos:
    5.615
    I think the idea is to move + move without risking the controller, then move + plant xenotech. As it is, the Xenotech is just an order tax /shrug

    Personally, I'm waiting for this year's narrative campaign. The Templar "hunt" has been promised, and it is delicious.
     
    A RobertShepherd le gusta esto.
  18. ijw

    ijw Ian Wood aka the Wargaming Trader. Rules & Wiki
    Infinity Rules Staff Warcor

    Registrado:
    25 Abr 2017
    Mensajes:
    7.353
    Me Gusta recibidos:
    14.845
    I must still be missing or misunderstanding something in your posts, sorry. :-(

    Coherency plus 'move forwards 2" and back 2"' by the Xenotech gives you 10" distance between the Controller and the area that Place Multiscanner can be successful. That means the Controller can stay a bit under 6" deep into their Deployment Zone. If there's nowhere safe to hide while you're that deep into your DZ, there are going to be much bigger issues with the game than the Xenotech...
     
  19. Masterblaster

    Masterblaster Well-Known Member
    Warcor

    Registrado:
    8 Nov 2017
    Mensajes:
    64
    Me Gusta recibidos:
    64
    Just read your complete discussion. Do you have any further info on the topic? Apart from beeing a dick or not or whatever the rules for Xeneotech seem to need some clarifications.
    Playing civilians active makes a complete difference to so many rules. Running around as shields for other units is just one of several bad errors.
     
  20. Mahtamori

    Mahtamori Well-Known Member

    Registrado:
    23 Nov 2017
    Mensajes:
    12.076
    Me Gusta recibidos:
    15.387
    .
    You're focusing on something that's not the issue. All the deployment skills does is give you more options where an enemy sniper or infiltrator can't see your trooper.
     
  • About Us

    We are a company founded in 2001 in Cangas (Spain), and devoted to design and manufacture games and figures. Our main product, Infinity the Game, was born with the ambition to satisfy the most demanding audience, offering the best quality.

     

    Why are we here?

     

    Because we are, first and foremost, players.

  • Quick Navigation

    Open the Quick Navigation