Proxy lvl 2, a very nice idea. I imagine a proxy lvl 2 who would change the proxy in something fireteam-like but without the need to stay in ZOC from the leader, representing the ability of the most avance jumper to control multiple body at once. This could come with an pricier set of bodies costing more than the classic ones : a sophotec like with different combinaison of 2 specialist doctor/engineer or engineer/HD, a new TO or a basic camo (but not infiltrated, like an Hexa, with KHD and sniper version), some MI with heavy weapon in the 30 points price range (like a Nisse or a Bagh Mari) and an HI choice in the 50 points price range (maybe DDO ?)
i am not expecting a complex new rule. simple like - an other posthuman set available including a LT option etc.
I don't think we'll ever get Posthumans Lv2. But if we were to get it, I hope it's just "simple like - an other posthuman set available including a LT option", as @perseus said. Proxy rules are already very complex, and keeping track of another group of bodies with a different (but similar) ruleset would be nightmarish for most of the people.
Character Posthumans ;p As for the point increase, either that or each Posthuman taking 2 slots on the combat group (regardless of number of bodies). And yeah, we will need a S6 TAG to compensate for the Marut, since there won't be much sense to pay 120 points for a MSV2 TAG when you can place 2 MSV3 Asuras for 130-140, or the Deva for 31. I mean, taking out smoke, you are limited to Camo levels in your targets to justify the use of this things, and considering how ALL the army will carry intuitive-able templates...
I'm hoping for limited access to smoke via LGL. That would somewhat fix this problem without adding warbands. If there is no smoke in Vedic, Marut lists will probably want to stay vanilla. Even now Asuras feel overpriced already for what they bring with Myrmidons by their side. Another crazy idea for Posthumans lvl 2 - make them behave like a link. One conciousness moving three bodies at the same time. LT Posthuman would also be great, but extra survivability via body switching could make almost all other LT options obsolete.
Yeah, smoke LGL may be an idea. Perhaps on a dakini or a rebot-like. BS11 dakini vs PH13 myrmidon, i don't think it would be overpowered, especially when you consider all a 16 pts myrm can do (CC, MA giving stealth, direct template, non hackable ...)
By the way, the robot that came with Andromedais an Alpeh robot, why not having one like him in Vedic as the LGL warband ?
It would be like the beasts in Tohaa... I'd prefer to go for a S5 HI remote, frankly... And I wouldn't mind if it had a profile with smoke, kinda like the Fasid.
I think Jumper Lvl would have to mean something like a better connection with the proxies, like having them able to ARO at the same time, or coordinate an order with no need for command token. More then 1 group would be something more related to a sectorial then a lvl. Maybe the lvl 2 brings out a new set of bodies that include a Lt to be used in sectorial.
I think I'm not sure I follow. Do you mean giving the Jumper Lv2 some sort of "inspiring leadership" option like Juana/Wallace has? If you are thinking coordinating several proxies at once, it would be a HUGE improvement, since atm you cannot make a coordinated order with 2-3 bodies (because they are the same troop), and the impact would be derived mostly from the free coordinated per turn. Also, since we would get a second posthuman, so to speak, wouldn't that mean being able to coordinate 4 bodies? A little broken, since the most limiting factor for Proxy usage atm is the SWC cost :S
Maybe it would not be broken in a sectorial. If only the sectorial used lvl 2 it could kind of be a the fireteam bonus of moving several troops with 1 order. In this case a higher lvl2 of Jumper would mean capability to control several bodies at the same time. Disadvantage is clearly that you still only provide 1 order. So you are still chewing other troops orders. Something like that. I mean, it makes more sense to me that a lvl 2 means more control of the proxies somehow. Also usually 1 PH controls up tp 3 proxies, so it would only work on his group not other
If we had access to multiple posthumans, it wouldn’t make sense, that they couldn’t share proxies - after all a proxy is basically just a tool to a digital entity. That said. If we get access to multiple posthumans, without any deeper rebalancing of them, it’ll truly be a sign to jump ship and get into another more balanced game.
If you take a look at it more proxies mean more SWC and points with even less orders. 6 models with 2 orders? Maybe it could work maybe it wouldn't... but I don hope they make a theme out of it because that really is the feeling of Aleph :)
I’ve taken a look at it, and for the price of three über troopers with a wide range of capabilities, most other factions will get one - and that one won’t even be on par with the individual posthuman proxy. Just compare the MK2 with the dasyu.. So you do not get less orders, you do not get less quality, you do not get any less durability; I really have a hard time seeing, what you sacrifice? And mind you all armies pay SWC for their heavy weapons, there really is nothing unique in that - and even if that would be an issue, you’re still free to go with ultra cheap, super specialists. Make the comparison with Yan Huo for instance. At 2 SWC and 54 points for a barebones HMC on a HI trooper. Compared to a MK4 HMG, a MK2 hacker and a MK1 Doc at 2.5 SWC and 56 points. Where do we lose out?
Dunno ... Kuang Shi ? Aragoto ? Su Jian ? Wanna compare deva and Odalisks ? Of course if you take only one option you can always find something and say "ho look it is totally overpowered !". Posthuman is good, it is so good that it is the closest thing to an autoinclude. But i don't think vanilla Aleph is overpowered, despite it has the posthuman. You need to see the whole thing and not just one part of it.
I don’t think anyone has claimed Aleph as a faction to be overpowered, so please stop twisting my words. I chose the Yan Huo, because it is the closest comparison to the MK4, I could think of. a barebones no-frills HI with a big gun - slightly better than a HMG, but not much - and still a fairly popular model. I don’t mind posthumans being good - I chose to play an elite army after all - but I do mind them being completely out of balance, as they are now. Pre-HSN3, they at least had some balancing factors to justify the discount, but now, they might not be an auto-include, but you’re consciously making a bad choice not to take them. The only balancing Factor, they have is their AVA1 And I don’t think we’re looking at the same picture. Infinity point cost isn’t like 40K based on some lose assumptions, but adhere to a pretty strict formula, where individual models pay the same for access to certain abilities, what makes the factions different from each other, are the design of the particular mix of troopers, they have access to, and their specific combinations of skills, stats and armaments - and not something like the Bloody McBlood Bloods being given free chain axes to make them the cc army. In that context, the pricing of posthumans is completely up the wazoo.
While it's true that Posthumans as a whole are essentially autoinclude, on the level of individual bodies that is not true actually. Some people swear by Mk.I, others by Mk.II, but basically there is a whole gamut of options being taken (well, Mk.III is likely a different story). As for being out-of-whack, kinda, but as Aleph is actually pretty badly priced in many of the other choices, on the whole Aleph is fairly okayish. I thought so for awhile, but the more I think about it, it's not really so. Remember, a normal Infinity trooper pays the base price of providing an Order to the pool and being able to ARO during reactive. Yet each Proxy body only provides ~1/3 of an Order and ~1/3 of an ARO. Admittedly, ARO issue is possible to avoid by careful play - but it is still something player needs to track and ensure doesn't pop up. Or you get into "well, I want this one to shoot so I guess this one will just Dodge". I know people playing against them often feel cheated when they remove a body that they didn't also remove an Order, but that is because that body didn't provide an Order in the first place... ;TLDR : I'd be fine if they increase Posthuman prices a bit, but in that case they should also reduce a lot of prices across Aleph because a) NWI is overpriced; b) MSV3 is overpriced; c) what is the balancing act for Aleph having very limited access to heavy weaponry?; d) REMs can't Dodge, go Prone, or ignore Hackers.
I strongly disagree. Yes, Infinity is more or less based on a calculated point system, and it's a good thing (i would have rather chosen the skaven in old W Battle as a better example on how much that system was skrewed). But, in the end, the system is made of human choices. What is the cost of some equipment ? What is the cost of that skill ? What equipment/skill a certain troop has ? I mean, i design a troop. I want it to be around 20 pts. What if i see that all equipment i put makes her 24 pts ? Ho well, i can just give it frenzy, it will gives it the desired discount, and since it is meant to be in a link, i essentially gave it a discount for free. Another example, mimetism is around 1 pt. So why the CA is the only one with a mimetism TR bot ? After all, we could give it to all the others, it would be fair if we increase the cost of them by 1 pt, isn't it ? Do you understand what i mean ? You cannot rely on the simple assumption that a calculation based cost will be fair. So, is posthuman's cost fair ? Frankly, i dunno. I would need to have a lot of battle reports to be able to judge it. Corvus Belli may have it, but i don't. So this is only my opinion, i don't think it is unbalanced, because i don't see the Aleph army as unbalanced. Increasing the posthuman's cost would harm Vanilla Aleph, since it has many expensive options and PH being the only cheap one. Would it be still playable ? I think so. Would it be fair ? I don't have enough knowledge to judge, but i don't think it could work with the point increase some people (not you, but i already had that talk with others) want (ie: MK2 should cost roughly around the dasyu, MK1 should be like 27-28 pts and so ...)
Of course you can, or at least strive for fairness. Otherwise what is the point of points? The posthumans were already a decent choice, when they were balanced by some obvious drawbacks. When they lost all drawbacks, but kept the discount, they became unbalanced. And you don’t need a gazillion battle reports, ask any vanilla player what their first troop choice is, and how many of their wins they can attribute to their posthumans. It’s that simple.
Inspired by scylla (I know she's not vedic). I'd like to see more models with g:sync. It would be cool if you had a lot of weapon options for devabots like HMGs, snipers, and HML, and then lots of equipment/special skill options for dakinis like automedkit, minelayer, or smoke with most models (devas, sophetect, etc) having to choose one to g:sync with. It would not only give the sectorial a different flavor from core, haris, duo but also would give the player the choice of play style. I'm going to run the MSV2 deva do I want to sync it with a dakini with smoke cuz that's AIDS for my opponent, do I want to use a dakini with automedkit to revive me somehow, or do I want a devabot with a heavy flamer so if my opponent shoots back they will have to eat a flame template. I was also thinking that the Asura could sync with 2 bots to make her really threatening. This while broken could easily be over 100pts (for what would still be 1 order). Lastly I would like to see more proxys and allow within the sectorial to have more then 1 unit of proxys. The vedic faction has 14 units (if you count all the proxys as different units) so we don't NEED more then 2-3 new models but since we can't use all the proxys in any given list that number looks more like 10 which is lackluster.
